Posted by: voodoo47
« on: 04. October 2024, 14:36:46 »a master of eloquence, I ain't. feel free to edit and simplify.
Posted by: ZylonBane
« on: 04. October 2024, 14:29:10 »I see you've described "the DML loader will copy the inherited script property" in an impressively verbose way.
Posted by: voodoo47
« on: 04. October 2024, 07:55:17 »and dml guide updated with the info.
also there is no sane scenario where you'd want script duplication to happen (editor or not), so this is unintended functionality at best, I'd say - remember, we had to fix quite a few instances of duplicate scripts both on the archetypes and concretes, very likely this has happened because the original mappers weren't aware of this and caused the duplication when adding the prop.
also there is no sane scenario where you'd want script duplication to happen (editor or not), so this is unintended functionality at best, I'd say - remember, we had to fix quite a few instances of duplicate scripts both on the archetypes and concretes, very likely this has happened because the original mappers weren't aware of this and caused the duplication when adding the prop.
Posted by: ZylonBane
« on: 03. October 2024, 23:33:31 »Confirmed in DromEd, adding a Script object via DML duplicates the inherited script object. This is actually normal behavior in DromEd when adding most properties, whether it's a runtime inherited property or not. A handful of properties seem to be internally excepted from this copying, like the Script property. The DML processor apparently doesn't respect this flag or however it's implemented.
So... not sure if bug or intentional.
Anyway, fixed by moving to a metaprop. Mod updated. Removed your post advising to edit the DML so there isn't conflicting advice in the mod thread. Correct course of action is update the mod, not hack the mod.
So... not sure if bug or intentional.
Anyway, fixed by moving to a metaprop. Mod updated. Removed your post advising to edit the DML so there isn't conflicting advice in the mod thread. Correct course of action is update the mod, not hack the mod.
Posted by: voodoo47
« on: 02. October 2024, 13:53:18 »well.. sure, but I'm positive the only thing we can really do here is to describe the scenario thoroughly and file it under just don't.
Posted by: ZylonBane
« on: 02. October 2024, 13:31:13 »Maybe when the DML processor automatically adds the script property before modifying it, it's copying the inherited script property, resulting in script duplication. I'll have to do some testing.
Posted by: voodoo47
« on: 02. October 2024, 13:13:31 »assigning props via dml works 99% the same as applying them in the editor. this is the 1%, a dml quirk you have to be aware of else there will be issues. just like when you change the class tags/schema of a concrete object - no issues when changed in the editor, but if you do it via dml, you will have to save and reload at least once when playing the game for the change to be fully applied.
I was aware that something like this is going on (that's why my dmls stomp on empty script slots), but lacked the last piece of puzzle (the Grenades object, which by default doesn't have any scripts) which you now have provided - I will mention this peculiarity in the dml guide, I just need to give it some form that would be understandable by human beings.
I was aware that something like this is going on (that's why my dmls stomp on empty script slots), but lacked the last piece of puzzle (the Grenades object, which by default doesn't have any scripts) which you now have provided - I will mention this peculiarity in the dml guide, I just need to give it some form that would be understandable by human beings.
Posted by: ZylonBane
« on: 02. October 2024, 13:06:33 »That's great, but I'd still like to know why what should be identical operations are having different results.
Posted by: sarge945
« on: 02. October 2024, 12:53:28 »The metaprop is definitely the right way to go.
Posted by: voodoo47
« on: 02. October 2024, 06:56:10 »try some random (dml) things, like ticking the not inherit flag, and/or add the scripts prop via dml first and then the actual script.
if it's stupid but it works..
//or I can just try it myself - change the Script number from 3 to 0, fixed. assign custom script via metaprop also works ok;
if it's stupid but it works..
//or I can just try it myself - change the Script number from 3 to 0, fixed. assign custom script via metaprop also works ok;
Code: [Select]
CreateArch "Misc Metaprops" "UnstableGrenMeta"
{
}
+MetaProp "Grenades" "UnstableGrenMeta"
+ObjProp "UnstableGrenMeta" "Scripts" {
"Script 3" "zbUnstableGrenades"
}and that's probably the way the script should be assigned anyway. would still use Script 0 slot on the meta, as there is no reason not to.Posted by: ZylonBane
« on: 02. October 2024, 02:04:24 »So this is interesting. Basically, with the mod active, single grenades split off from a stack add TWO to the stack count when loaded into the grenade launcher instead of one. And it combines, so if you put two single split-off grenades back into a stack of two, they'll add four when loaded.
Here's the really crazy thing: The mod DML adds a script to the Grenades object, which by default doesn't have any scripts. If I modify the gamesys so it has an empty Scripts object, the duplication bug stops happening.
??????????
Here's the really crazy thing: The mod DML adds a script to the Grenades object, which by default doesn't have any scripts. If I modify the gamesys so it has an empty Scripts object, the duplication bug stops happening.
??????????
Posted by: voodoo47
« on: 09. March 2023, 09:08:43 »that's the rest axis, that is something different.
Posted by: sarge945
« on: 09. March 2023, 06:03:22 »Nothing in SS2 rotates when dropped by the player.
The gamepig rotates as it hits the ground
Posted by: ZylonBane
« on: 08. March 2023, 18:10:30 »That being said, a mod or upgrade that allowed looting the grenades off grenade hybrids could be interesting. Maybe use them directly, or convert them into frag grenade ammo.
Posted by: ZylonBane
« on: 08. March 2023, 15:22:14 »Nope, nope, and nope.
If the model was rotated on its side, it would be floating above the ground. To make it not float above the ground, its physics model would have to be made tiny, which would make it very difficult to shoot
Hybrids don't throw grenade launcher ammo. They throw grenades. No, I don't know where they get them.
Nothing in SS2 rotates when dropped by the player.
If the model was rotated on its side, it would be floating above the ground. To make it not float above the ground, its physics model would have to be made tiny, which would make it very difficult to shoot
Hybrids don't throw grenade launcher ammo. They throw grenades. No, I don't know where they get them.
Nothing in SS2 rotates when dropped by the player.
Posted by: voodoo47
« on: 08. March 2023, 09:42:31 »I would do two more things - edit the single grenade model to not be thrown in a vertical position (looks even weirder when just dropped onto the ground without exploding), and once that is done, change the thrown grenade (projectile) model of the grenade hybrid into that. another discrepancy gone.
//actually, in addition to laying the single grenade object on its side, I think a completely new world model for the grenade bundle would be appropriate, see the mockup below. the vanilla model is very ok when sitting on the ground, but doesn't look too great once being flung through the air.
also, a little bit of rotation when being thrown wouldn't be too bad.
[grenade_bundle.jpg expired]
//actually, in addition to laying the single grenade object on its side, I think a completely new world model for the grenade bundle would be appropriate, see the mockup below. the vanilla model is very ok when sitting on the ground, but doesn't look too great once being flung through the air.
also, a little bit of rotation when being thrown wouldn't be too bad.
[grenade_bundle.jpg expired]
Posted by: ZylonBane
« on: 08. March 2023, 06:07:41 »Posted as v1.0. Seems stable enough.
Posted by: voodoo47
« on: 07. March 2023, 21:53:52 »ok, will not do that next time. //beta warning added.
Posted by: ZylonBane
« on: 07. March 2023, 21:26:34 »I like to think of Engineering as a place where people who are slightly more technical can look at something before it's released to the masses. The sort of people who generally understand not to grab everything posted here and throw it in their mod pack.
It may not be true, but I like to think of it that way.
It may not be true, but I like to think of it that way.
Posted by: voodoo47
« on: 07. March 2023, 21:02:08 »I did - Engineering is public, so even if the mod is beta, it shouldn't be a problem. no harm in a few more people taking a look and finding potential issues?
can kill the post if you think this is too beta.
can kill the post if you think this is too beta.
Posted by: ZylonBane
« on: 07. March 2023, 18:16:06 »Voodoo, you didn't link to an unfinished mod on the Night Dive discord, did you?
Posted by: ZylonBane
« on: 07. March 2023, 03:42:23 »Okay, first post updated with test version 2. Now switches models of all grenades to a single-grenade model for grenade objects with a stack count of 1.
This was even more of a pain in the ass than I was anticipating, because Dark apparently has an issue where if you set a model on a concrete object, then later remove the model property from the concrete, it won't revert to using the model set on the archetype. I had to copy the concrete object's model property onto it from its own archetype to get it to use the default model again, which is just... so stupid.
This was even more of a pain in the ass than I was anticipating, because Dark apparently has an issue where if you set a model on a concrete object, then later remove the model property from the concrete, it won't revert to using the model set on the archetype. I had to copy the concrete object's model property onto it from its own archetype to get it to use the default model again, which is just... so stupid.
Posted by: voodoo47
« on: 06. March 2023, 18:46:29 »it's still weird even if it's a box, because it still can be dozens of grenades.
Posted by: sarge945
« on: 06. March 2023, 17:16:37 »I thought dynamic grenade models based on stack size was a good idea for SCP rather than this mod including it's own grenade model, and was going to suggest it, but voodoo makes a good point. If it stops changing after 3 it's just as janky as if it never changes.
Honestly I think a "box of grenades" makes the most sense for a world model if you don't want to run into stack size weirdness.
Honestly I think a "box of grenades" makes the most sense for a world model if you don't want to run into stack size weirdness.
Posted by: ZylonBane
« on: 06. March 2023, 15:20:58 »I'll look into it then. Deleting bits from the vanilla models is something that probably even I could do.
Posted by: voodoo47
« on: 06. March 2023, 14:49:55 »I don't believe there are any. and I mean yes, we would be just trading one weirdness for another (any number of grenades looking like a pile of three for any number of grenades looking like just one), but in this kind of scenario, it would be better, I think.
Posted by: ZylonBane
« on: 06. March 2023, 14:22:08 »Also, including alternate grenade ammo models could produce visual weirdness when used with any mods that alter the vanilla models. Though I don't know of any that actually do that.very sure Olfred could carve one out.
Posted by: JDoran
« on: 06. March 2023, 14:08:06 »This is a great idea! Thanks, ZB.
Posted by: voodoo47
« on: 06. March 2023, 14:07:11 »very sure Olfred could carve one out.
Posted by: ZylonBane
« on: 06. March 2023, 13:55:21 »AFAIK there are no models of single grenades for each grenade type. The game displaying a pile of three even when there's actually more or less than three in the stack is an issue that's always existed.
Posted by: voodoo47
« on: 06. March 2023, 10:24:39 »would probably change the world object from a grenade pile to a single grenade. would be less weird, I think.
Posted by: sarge945
« on: 06. March 2023, 10:07:22 »You should call it "SS1 style Throwable Grenades for SS2" if you want to inflate your download count with a clickbait title.
Posted by: ZylonBane
« on: 06. March 2023, 04:33:50 »The Many's corrosive influence has spread beyond just degrading the guns. Now it's degrading the grenades as well! Grenade ammo has become dangerously unstable, and will explode if damaged or dropped too far. Use this to your advantage to set explosive traps for your enemies.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kAlrtwdy7_E
This is a first draft of a mod that makes all grenade ammo explode if shot, struck, or dropped further than at your feet. If you set off a stack of grenade ammo, they'll ALL explode. Seems to work okay, but I figured I'd post it here first in case anyone finds any problems or has any suggested enhancements.
The type of explosion spawned by each ammo type hasn't been hard-coded. Instead it actually follows the links back from the ammo object and grabs the corpse links from its projectile (for firing mode 1), so it should be compatible with all weapon mods, no matter how extreme.
I figure this change will give players who don't put points into Heavy Weapons something more fun to do with all that grenade ammo than recycling it. And being able to blow up grenade rounds just feels more immersive-simmy.
Also I really hope nobody's already done this.
EDIT: Thread closed. Mod released here: https://www.systemshock.org/index.php?topic=12217.0
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kAlrtwdy7_E
This is a first draft of a mod that makes all grenade ammo explode if shot, struck, or dropped further than at your feet. If you set off a stack of grenade ammo, they'll ALL explode. Seems to work okay, but I figured I'd post it here first in case anyone finds any problems or has any suggested enhancements.
The type of explosion spawned by each ammo type hasn't been hard-coded. Instead it actually follows the links back from the ammo object and grabs the corpse links from its projectile (for firing mode 1), so it should be compatible with all weapon mods, no matter how extreme.
I figure this change will give players who don't put points into Heavy Weapons something more fun to do with all that grenade ammo than recycling it. And being able to blow up grenade rounds just feels more immersive-simmy.
Also I really hope nobody's already done this.
EDIT: Thread closed. Mod released here: https://www.systemshock.org/index.php?topic=12217.0
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