SSR: System Shock Kickstarter

[674204888f647Learonys]

Also, the higher-tier pledges such as having an enemy or crewmember named after you sound very immersion-breaking.

immersion-breaking to who? The 0.1% that actually pledge for such a goal, or the 99.9% at which this name means almost nothing to? Give the 0.1% what they want, it's not even taking away anything from the remaining 99.9%. Off course you could enter really awkward names, but Night Dive again could give these names a twist, it's their game after all.

EDIT:

Fair enough.

I think they only used his face, though?

To be honest, I was more worried about seeing some character named XxXSomeMemeXxX.

Yeah, i get your point, but what's the chances of these names entering the game? I'd think they'd only allow the names of actual people in the game.

[674204888fa31fox]

One of the Kickstarter stretch goals - that is, goals that they plan to implement if they raise enough funding on Kickstarter - is to add RPG elements such as levels, perks, weapon upgrades, and research - a drastic shift in the type of game.

What I'm saying is that people will intentionally not want them to reach that $1.7m stretch goal so that they don't implement these features.

Funny thing is that I do like these things in ImSims but putting all that into a game that was supposed to be a remake and is called "System Shock" kind of rubs me the wrong way. It might work out well in the end but chances are that it ends up feeling like a very different game then the original - which then begs the question why they didn't go the last mile and developed something entirely fresh instead.

[674204888fb98Nameless Voice]

Yes, I agree with you completely.  I like complicated RPG elements in games, I just don't think they belong in System Shock - especially levels and perks.

[674204888fccfchickenhead]

I don't know what to think about the RPG stretch goal.

On one hand, I think, cool, they're trying to making the game more complex and a bit more like it's successors.

But on the other hand, I think, it would be weird if the hacker had no hacking skills.  Plus, they'd have to make the game so much more complicated so that certain character builds aren't unbalanced.

But, yeah, it be cool if it was an alternate mode.

Edit: they've already got $163,630 in like, an hour and a half?  This should be a breeze.

[674204888fe0eJoin2]

I wouldn't mind RPG systems in the form of hardware upgrades, implants, weapon modification etc. Wouldn't mind if they are not there for purist reasons either.

[674204888ffb3la0s]

I think one of the strengths of the original, was the class-less design, where you could, more or less, play the way you wanted. It was a RPG in another, more direct way. To me, Shock 2 felt a bit sloppy, with the RPG elements. It felt like a step backwards. Where a lot of the emergent gameplay was based around what you poured your points into.

Sort of. It did make sense in that game, but it always felt like a step away from what made the first game great. The systems were exposed directly in Shock 1.

I like the feeling of a world where the tools are a my disposal, and not limited by arbitrary numbers and stats. It can be fun, but for me Shock 1 and Thief, are great examples of how to do emergent gameplay, without having a skill-tree.

I'm old school like that.

[67420488900dfHikari]

I'm annoyed linux support is tied to the stretch goal since Unity is crossplatform as is.

[67420488903feZylonBane]

It was a RPG in another, more direct way.

Specifically, the "Not an RPG" way.

You'd best not be one of those "Any game where you can roleplay is an RPG!" dipsticks.

[67420488904fbla0s]

I might be. Dunno. But I'm pretty sure, some from the LGS team talked about this concept, way back. The way it blurred the lines between genres. I find that interesting.

[67420488906c8chickenhead]

I might be. Dunno.

At least he acknowledges it.

[67420488907ccJoin2]

It does share one or two core concepts with an RPG but it does not play anything like one, really. It's action/adventure/shooter/puzzle/survival horror/immersive sim. Throw in platformer too to be generous.

[67420488908a3chickenhead]

This is why I hate genre defining in video games.

[6742048890aa2chickenhead]

I'm annoyed linux support is tied to the stretch goal since Unity is crossplatform as is.

When was the last time Wine was updated?  Maybe that will work, but considering how much more processor-intensive this game will be, maybe that's a bit much to ask.

[6742048890de2la0s]

It does share one or two core concepts with an RPG but it does not play anything like one, really. It's action/adventure/shooter/puzzle/survival horror/immersive sim. Throw in platformer too to be generous.

Maybe I should rephrase.. the "immersive sim" part, includes roleplaying, without being a RPG. Does that make sense. That is what System Shock was and is for me. I apologize for mixing up the terms.

[6742048890f11Hikari]

System is too potato for me to test in wine. Which makes me sadface even though jimquisition showed what the polygon video showed pretty much was the entire demo outside of the yellow room.

[6742048891387RocketMan]

I don't really care what they do with SS1 since I'll continue to play the original over the new one...

However, as a lesson that ought to be learned, don't make the game you're working on a playground for kids with money to burn.  If you want to provide incentives, do so in ways that have nothing to do with the game content.  Give them "stuff", invite them to have a pizza lunch with the devs, give them a car for all I care.  Don't start mangling the game with cute little winks to every person who throws cash at them.  That sort of thing really ruins my enjoyment of the game.

[674204889176bJoin2]

^Backer rewards are generally cancer. Said it before and I'll say it again.

Maybe I should rephrase.. the "immersive sim" part, includes roleplaying, without being a RPG. Does that make sense. That is what System Shock was and is for me. I apologize for mixing up the terms.

Yes, that is what I meant by "It shares some core concepts with an RPG", e.g notable levels of player expression/authorship. I wouldn't define the game as in-part RPG though as there's really not that much freedom in Shock, and there's far more to your typical RPG than just that.

Anyhow, I'm surprised at the disgust by some. The demo shows imperfection, and perhaps some misguided principles, but it's close to hitting the mark. It shows a lot of promise all in all.

[6742048891c33Synaesthesia]

Anyhow, I'm surprised at the disgust by some. The demo shows imperfection, and perhaps some misguided principles, but it's close to hitting the mark. It shows a lot of promise all in all.

It's new, therefore it's bad. Because millennial casual gamers dumbed down trashcan robots mutants violin pre-alpha demo and reasons, of course.

[6742048891d5aHikari]

Yes let's blame it all on the fucking millinials. Let's blame it all on the millinials someone went 'while we're in here we might as well...'

It's different now it sucks.

[6742048891fdeJoin2]

It's new, therefore it's bad.

I doubt that's the case. Most people's criticisms seem valid to me, I just don't think any of it is enough to dismiss the game just yet, especially since it is alpha. Ideas do sometimes get scrapped, and imperfections often rectified in game dev after all so we'll see.

[67420488920f6Synaesthesia]

Right.

Which is why it's silly to get annoyed by it right now. The vast majority of the game isn't done yet. There's a lot of work left to do, and likely everything we see will go through a laundry list of changes way before it comes time for the end of 2017.

[6742048892223Join2]

Which is why it's silly to get annoyed by it right now.

There's still red flags that raise some doubts though, alpha or not. Some things are also set in stone by the kickstarter too, like a neurofunk cross orchestrated soundtrack. Yawn.
Nonetheless the game shows promise.

[674204889233eSynaesthesia]

I can't argue there. I can only hold out hope for an alternative soundtrack that isn't orchestral. Otherwise I'll fucking mod in the original soundtrack.

[6742048892644DKDArtagnan]

As a huge fan of SS1 (Top-3 of all time) - I think it looks very good.

For years, I've wanted a modern version of this game. To me, it was always about immersion first - and modern visuals and a comfortable UI would go a long way to aid in that way.

As for RPG elements, I'm a strong supporter of those - if they do it right.

Now, I always considered SS1 superior to SS2 - but I honestly think the RPG elements added immensely to the core gameplay. There's a reason I've replayed SS2 so many times, and that's largely because I greatly enjoy experimenting with different classes and builds.

I'm always a little confused when people call SS1 an RPG - because that was never how it felt to me. There was no real choice involved in terms of upgrading your software/gear - as they were simply incremental upgrades, and you'd get them all if you explored thoroughly. Also, I'd say half of them were pretty superfluous and mostly for show. Beyond that, there was no NPC interaction - and the combat system was entirely driven by player skill, not character skill. So, I don't see much in the way of traditional RPG elements.

From my point of view, the best way to handle RPG elements would be to integrate them into the original "VR headset" system, where you expand your skill-set through mutually exclusive software upgrades. That way, you preserve the original feel - and you preserve the immersion factor.

I'm curious to see how they handle Cyberspace - as I always thought it was undercooked in the original. I love the concept, and it's a shame they took it away in SS2 - but it didn't quite work right. It was clunky and not all that interesting - and there's great potential for expanding hacking gameplay in this remake.

Beyond that, I'd kill for a cooperative multiplayer mode - so I can share the experience after completing the game once.

I couldn't care less about an orchestral soundtrack, though, and I think the added death sequences sound like a complete waste of resources. There's no doubt the soundtrack could use a modern upgrade - but there's no reason to waste so much money on doing it with an orchestra. In fact, I think they should consider a fully ambient soundtrack - and have the original music available as an option.