SCP Beta 4 Issue Reporting

[6741de657a03bsarge945]

Here's stuff what was posted in the main SCP thread that I thought I would respond to here, since they generally are suggestions

Hello, i don't know if this is the right thread for suggestions (i've already made suggestions in the engineering section some time ago):

i have seen a few years ago that someone of you has made some fantastic toilets on board the rickenbacker (i don't find the posting anymore); is there any chance that it will be implemented someday? it would make it so much more immersive of course..

Then i have another suggestion : ) 

The very first room on the ops-deck (with the xerxes terminal) would be much more realistic & more lobby-like if there would be added some benches, trashcans, garbage, airducts, phone-terminals (ducts & destroyable machinery on the walls like in medsci on ops deck in general, it would make it much more coherent quality-wise or so; you can tell that those decks were made by different people) and maybe even put some glass-ceiling on the ceiling in that xerxes node room; i made some very rough examples with paint : )

Image: http://i67.tinypic.com/169m8sg.png

Image: http://i67.tinypic.com/29e56k7.png

rule of the thumb is "don't add stuff unless very necessary". a good example would be the shooting range, which didn't have the actual shooting targets even though the model exists in the resource archives, or the entire ops4, which was so empty that some items and decorations have been added. as far as that Xerxes room goes, it never struck me as particularly unfinished, and I don't really see what could be added without affecting the overall aesthetics in a negative way.

as far as the Rick toilets go, I personally am leaning slightly towards adding some, but never considered their lack significantly anomalous or immersion breaking - remember, a big chunk of Rick is inaccessible, so the toilets could just have been located there. anyway, they are ZB's creation, so he's calling the shots.

We see so many suggestions about things like this here, and they get shot down so often (which is fair, they are out of scope), that I sincerely think a "More details" companion mod would go a LONG way to making System Shock 2 feel more modernised. Between this, the garden sugestions in the other thread, and all the (possibly hundreds) of little area/layout tweaks, this could make for some awesome stuff. I could imaging having an ops deck that isn't one long grey hallway, and generally a much much better and more detailed world, as it seems that almost all of the atmosphere in this game comes from the sound and the situation and logs rather than the actual world details, which is a real shame.

I'd be down for that. I have some modelling experience if anyone is interested, although that's modern stuff with tools like Maya, not sure how usable that would be with this crusty old engine (sorry but it's true).

1. always.
2. no, it doesn't work, but we have a wip script that will make it work. it will be released as a standalone mod when complete.

If this ends up in a minimod, I would recommend changing the balance since being completely invisible to all annelids is pretty overpowered. Maybe keep the power but make it drain battery as well as psi (or something). I dunno.

Attached here is a PDF of issues and suggestions I've put together for the next SCP.

If anything seems unclear or in need of further proof, let me know and I'll upload it in video.

CORRECTIONS:

- there is another headless corpse found in the hallway leading to Dr. Watts's office in medsci1.mis; object number is 492.

- the object number for the slanted window above the lift in Cryo Recovery in medsci1.mis is 207, not 1160.

- the object number for the broken window in the Biopsy Lab in medsci2.mis is 1051, not 105.

- the object number for the second replicator in many.mis is 68, not 56.

(God I hate correcting my mistakes AFTER submission.)

I have read this whole document, and I will cover my opinion in depth:

•integrate New Quest Notifier
• integrate “Where Am I?” Extreme Retro Mod (specifically for shodan.mis)
• integrate Portrait Fix
• integrate rec3 1F mall map fixer-upper and ops4 command center map fixer-upper

yes yes yes and yes. Basically all of these are things I would consider mandatory, and they don't really change the gameplay at all. Might also want to add Hud Logs too

• new object request, if the modeler has the time: add a headless male corpse and a severed
head with it, and replace half the female ones with them:

Why though? What does this accomplish? I don't understand the reasoning behind this at all.

• when shooting a wall at point-blank range with a pistol or assault rifle, muzzle flash does not
appear during the shot, only until immediately after moving or looking away from the wall
(strangely this does not apply to shotguns, as the muzzle flash is never rendered at all at
point blank)

Should be fixed but I bet this is an engine issue and can't be fixed by SCP at all

• body bags (−3073) should sound like fabric when impacted, not metal

Probably. Is there a fabric sound in the game? If not one can probably be found.

• membrane walls (−983) should be breakable by Localized Pyrokinesis
• the main status LED of security cameras (−367) is not flush with the sensor, observable
when looking up from underneath
• stasis field generator should also affect annelid grubs
• multiple concurrent BBetty notifications should be queued and not played simultaneously
• BBetty psi barks should be panned center and not right (this is consistent with how every
other BBetty notification is panned in SCP) [download]
• start–end transmission cues for psi-reaver Korenchkin’s audio logs (LOG0601.WAV,
LOG0606.WAV, LOG0607.WAV, LOG0709.WAV) should be panned center and not left (this is
consistent with how every other audio log is panned in SCP) [download]

Yes. These all seem like strict bugfixes

• Remote Electron Tampering should be buffed to 10 seconds + 10 seconds per PSI instead
of +5, so that it isn’t a completely useless discipline, especially given how ubiquitous security
control stations are on lower difficulties

The problem with RET is that the way security is handled in this game is extremely broken and it's already trivial to bypass it in almost every way. This skill could permanently disable security and cost only 1 CM and it would still not be worth taking. To buff/fix this, I would suggest doing something completely different/radical with it, or changing the security model in a fundamental way (like making destroyed cameras set off alarms, ala SECMOD). Both of these approaches are out of scope for SCP, so I doubt this is going to happen. RET seems like it will always be an inherently useless ability because it can't be fixed without significant changes to the game and it can't be removed because it's part of the vanilla game. Maybe it should just permanently stick around as "that useless thing you should never pick", which is a non-ideal situation (especially for new players who might expect the game to be balanced), but there's not much I can think of, unless somehow it was made worth the cost (or was simply free at the start of the game if you start with an OSA path regardless of the choices you make in your career, and be half or quarter the CM cost for everyone else). All of these are (significant) gameplay changes though. Maybe as a minimod. Either way, I don't think giving it more seconds is really that useful.

If I was designing this skill from scratch, I would design it like this (again, out of scope but I am having fun here):
- It always disables any currently active alarm (and stops enemies respawning), so that it can be used as an "oh shit" button
- During it's duration, the player is invisible to all cameras
- During it's duration, failing to hack anything won't have negative consequences (alarm set off, box blowing up etc), as their inbuilt security devices are "bypassed"
- Significantly lowered PSI and CM cost
- Free for OSA players (they start the game with it)

This doesn't exactly fix the problems with it, but might make it a tad more useful and since it would be free, maybe someone would use it occasionally. TBH Psi in general seems like an unbalanced mess and I wish someone would go through and thoroughly rebalance all the skills.

• Electron Suppression should work on security cameras properly (currently it stops the
rotation and mutes it, but the camera is still able to trigger the alarm)

Yeah this seems like a pretty big oversight. Then again, maybe it shouldn't effect cameras AT ALL, to make Remote Electron Tampering actually have some limited use (see above).

• Photonic Redirection, when cast while already activated, should not have BBetty bark
“invisibility deactivated” and “invisibility activated” at the same time (not only is it obnoxious
but also inaccurate, since Photonic Redirection never deactivates at all in that buffer – “invisi-
bili-visi-bility deact-act-activated”)

Yes. Maybe have a check to make sure no other powers do this. PSI in general is really unpolished in this game, suggesting to me it was somewhat rushed. It could use a bit of polish.

• Psionic Hypnogenesis and Imposed Neural Restructuring should also affect annelid grubs

Maybe. Not sure about this one.

• hacked turrets should not shoot annelid swarms

Can turrets even damage them? Seems like a pretty big oversight if not.

• Endurance stat should also affect air supply

Yeah making more things tied to RPG elements in an RPG does make sense. It's a gameplay change, but it's small and makes sense I guess. I don't think there are any real important swimming sections in the game though, so I doubt anyone would even notice this at all. The only time something like this would be remotely useful would be for depressurising of sections of the ship, which only ever happens once and it's a complete non-threat (not that I am suggesting changing that).

...All the specific mission changes...

Most of these make sense and are too numerous to go through individually. Almost all of them seem like bug fixes which is fine.

[6741de657ad1ebeauapropos]

Why though? What does this accomplish? I don't understand the reasoning behind this at all.

What, you don't find it a bit strange that all 8 decapitated corpses in the game are female? And on top of that, in the faded-blue affiliationless attire? Clearly this reeks of a rushed release.

It would also be nice if some of those corpses were in their respective uniforms. 

[6741de657b03eRoSoDude]

The description for Psychogenic Cyber-Affinity in psihelp.str incorrectly states the duration as 2 minutes + 1 minute per PSI, when it is in fact 60 seconds + 30 seconds per PSI:

Psi5:"Psychogenic Cyber-Affinity\n\nIncreases your Cybernetic Affinity by 2.\n\nDuration: 2 minutes + 1 minute per PSI"

This is a vanilla error, from what I can tell.

[6741de657b1acbeauapropos]

Issues post the PDF I uploaded are and will be reported to the spreadsheet (in case it's still being looked over, despite 2-year inactivity).

[6741de657b307voodoo47]

public inactivity.

but yeah, you moving them into the google doc would be nice, not going to say no to that.

[6741de657b5edbeauapropos]

but yeah, you moving them into the google doc would be nice, not going to say no to that.

When I said "Issues post the PDF I uploaded", I meant from now on, any issues after the time the PDF was uploaded. Sorry for the confusion.

Anyway, part of the reason I went with putting it in a separate document in the first place is that I didn't want to make a nuisance of myself clogging up a good portion of the spreadsheet (and potentially hitting the character and/or cell limit). Another reason is the organizing and the overall formatting problems some reports could pose when transferred over to a table-cell structure, like the headless corpse locations or the Trainer log.

[6741de657b6ddvoodoo47]

just go ahead with all current/future issues. I'll crunch through the pdf in due time.

[6741de657b89bRoSoDude]

Not an SCP-specific issue, but couldn't think of where else to bring this up. There's an extremely abusable infinite health (and psi) exploit that you can accomplish by simple raising and lowering the difficulty in the game menu. When you change difficulties mid-game, the game will recalculate your health by subtracting your missing hitpoints from the new maximum, but it will never go below 1HP. So if you switch to Impossible, then Easy, then back to the desired difficulty, you can shrink the missing hitpoints to a maximum of 9-30 HP for END 1-6 and thus gain any missing health beyond that. The same applies to the player's missing psi points. As you may already know, the same strategy works with the EndurBoost implant, which recalculates the player's health in the same manner and thus if you are left at 1HP with the EndurBoost implant installed, you can remove it and put it back on to heal whatever boost you get from +1 END. This requires you to keep the damn thing on all the time and it's only a few hitpoints, at least.

I can't think of any way you could possibly fix this other than hacking it so you couldn't change the difficulty mid-game or something. I was kinda surprised you could even change the difficulty in the first place since it alters so much. I only mentioned it because I was watching a streamer who discovered this exploit and started abusing it like crazy.

[6741de657b9b7voodoo47]

yeah, this is abusable as hell, but there is not much anyone can do about it (much like we can't really stop anyone from opening the console and typing summon_obj whatever).

a regular person should have little problem simply not cheating/exploiting.

[6741de657bb2bsarge945]

Just a quick question: I know some items were modified to not break when transitioning between levels (like the wormheart implant and wormskin armor).

Were Psi Boosters also modified to not lose their effects when transitioning/loading? There's nothing about it in the SCP 4 change notes file

If so, this should probably be fixed.

I would also recommend allowing stacking their duration when used, so that someone who wants to be "good at psi all the time" can pop a whole bunch and not have to worry about them for a while. Re-using them from your inventory every few minutes is annoying.

--

On a completely unrelated note. The psi power that recharges items (Electron Cascade) is wasted if you close your inventory, and you lose the psi you spent on it. Could this be fixed by making it only deduct the psi cost if you actually click on an item? I assume the engine doesn't allow that.

[6741de657bc48RoSoDude]

Just noticed that the Worm Skin armor lists 20% combat protection in the inventory, but actually gives 30% combat protection in the metaproperties. Not sure if that's been noted.

[6741de657bd24voodoo47]

it's 30 (and 40 rad 40 tox) in my beta4 - you sure you are not loading some different gamesys by mistake?

[6741de657be03RoSoDude]

...No, you're right. I must have gotten myself mixed up with my vanilla export or something. Disregard.

[6741de657bfd0ZylonBane]

I keep encountering players who have no idea it's possible to just blast through SHODAN's shields in the final boss fight. I've been trying to think of ways to make it more obvious that they're taking damage.

Best idea I can think of is to make the shield segments all start the same color, then change color as they take damage. For example start green, then turn yellow, then red when they're almost destroyed.

An additional tweak might be to turn down the shield regeneration rate. The player gets sniped at by the SHODAN avatars so much that also having the shields regenerate seems unnecessary for keeping pressure on the player.

Thoughts?

[6741de657c3d2sarge945]

I keep encountering players who have no idea it's possible to just blast through SHODAN's shields in the final boss fight. I've been trying to think of ways to make it more obvious that they're taking damage.

Best idea I can think of is to make the shield segments all start the same color, then change color as they take damage. For example start green, then turn yellow, then red when they're almost destroyed.

An additional tweak might be to turn down the shield regeneration rate. The player gets sniped at by the SHODAN avatars so much that also having the shields regenerate seems unnecessary for keeping pressure on the player.

Thoughts?

Most games usually have some sort of "shimmer" or something when something big is taking damage. Colour changing is a good idea. Having them change colour briefly when shot could work too. Basically, as long as there's some feedback when it gets shot.

Instead of slowing the regeneration, it might make sense to give it a delay after taking damage before it starts to regenerate, something like 6 seconds. This means you have to keep the pressure on, but at the same time you won't instantly lose your progress because you need to shoot the avatar quickly.

It would probably be less confusing in general if ALL the shield segmenst shared a (somewhat larger) health pool. So instead of having to shoot the individual segments, you just focus on shooting the shield itself enough to bring it down. Having to keep track of shield segments AND shodans avatars AND the electric floor is a bit too much.

[6741de657c4d7ZylonBane]

You know you don't have to quote the entire post that's immediately above yours.

[6741de657c628RoSoDude]

Starting the shield panels off the same color and having it vary as you deal damage seems like the right idea. I would imagine that the technicolor arrangement was originally in place so you could track the shield panels as they swapped positions, but this is irrelevant now that you have a smooth rotation.

Strongly disagree with making the shield panels share a health pool -- that removes the depth of tracking the panels as they rotate while managing projectiles and avatars. The bossfight is already lacking in mechanical challenge as it is, any change should only make it more engaging (and intuitive) to fight.

[6741de657c747sarge945]

I wonder if it's worth changing the "On most decks you'll find a quantum bio-reconsstructrion device..." polito email to use the Newbie variable, similarly to the email about charging a power cell.

[6741de657c832ZylonBane]

It isn't.

[6741de657cd78RoSoDude]

Is there any way we can fix Localized Pyrokinesis causing constant damage noises with psi shields active? Shit's super annoying.

Also, I do in fact get grunting pain sounds when it destroys decorative objects. Can provide plenty of examples if necessary.

[6741de657cef1voodoo47]

yeah, that's completely and permanently fixed in the latest SS2tool update - didn't I mention this somewhere? //ah, it's in the Secmod topic, you probably don't read every single post there.

remember that strange incend stim you were removing from SCP b4 in one of your minimods? that actually is a duct tape solution for the problem (to be removed in b5, as it's fixed properly now).


attaching the standalone fix (vanilla pyro values).
[burn fix.7z expired]

[6741de657cff1voodoo47]

actually, might wanna double check the values, those might be from Secmod. the tool should have the vanilla values 100%.

[6741de657d0eeRoSoDude]

I keep having the Command Bridge elevator kill me when it reaches the bottom floor. Is this known and fixed?

[6741de657d1ddvoodoo47]

nope - pics/vids/saves would be helpful.

I mean, if you are standing under it then yes, getting squished is normal.