Permadeath mod

[673f49c3513e0Kolya]

How to use
Back up your save games (or the whole SS2 game folder).
Extract the attached archive to your game using 7-zip.

What it does
The archive contains folders that SS2 uses for saving, each with an empty CAMPAIGN file inside. These folder and files are set to "read only" in Windows permissions. Hence the game cannot write saves anymore. Don't worry, it won't crash if you try to save.

Things to be aware of

• 7-zip retains the "read only" file permission, but other extractors might not. Untested.
  
• It doesn't work with the mod manager, presumably because the engine doesn't check mod_path when it loads a save game.
  
• I haven't tested what happens when the game tries to make an autosave, but it should be fine.
  
• TBH I haven't tested anything, except that it blocks saving. 
  

[permadeath.7z expired]

[673f49c351703sarge945]

I might actually modify this slightly to act as a "bronzeman" mode where you can only use autosaves. There's still potential for cheese when near a bulkhead, but it isn't too bad.

[673f49c3519c1Kolya]

I might actually modify this slightly to act as a "bronzeman" mode where you can only use autosaves.

Yeah, that's probably more useful than disabling saving completely.
What's with cheese in bulkheads?

[673f49c351c27RoSoDude]

You could functionally perform a manual save by going to the bulkhead to autosave, is the idea.

[673f49c351e33Join2]

If possible, perhaps disable autosaving after one-time use per instance of bulkhead? Harsh, but the game has notable reliance on RNG (all instances of the mini-game, enemy spawns, loot drops) as well as some heavy consequences for certain failures that beg to be scummed such as getting spotted by a camera and having to face insane waves of enemies spawning in, or sit in a safe corner and wait it out for two boring minutes, or once again performing the RNG mini-game to hack the system to reset it (wait, that's a secmod feature I think).
That along with very few points of no return in the game makes returning to bulkheads frequently a no brainer. Still would be better than completely unrestricted saving (BOTM in particular would be pretty hardcore since is a point of no return) yet very cheesable and the game would often demand said cheese, just as it demands it all now e.g saving before attempting the mini-game (on "impossible" where every action counts, at least).

Best compromise would perhaps be one-time use bulkhead autosaves and very rare save stations implemented that cost nanites to use, along with dangerous respawns in these areas to discourage backtracking to them. A man can dream.

[673f49c352061sarge945]

Restricting it to bulkheads once only is impossible, but I don't feel it's too bad even with bulkhead cheese. Most of your nanite costs are going to be in parts of levels where reloading is enough of a penalty (like the cargo bays) where it won't be worth it, so you will live with bad luck/failures even if you can technically reload.

The real problem with the minigames happens when you do the Patented* Elder Scrolls Pickpocket-Scum™, which in SS2 amounts to "Hack box. Fail. Reload. Hack box. Fail. Reload. Hack box. Fail. Reload. Hack Box, success", which gives you a massive overabundance of nanites. This itself spirals out into many other problems, like resource overabundance as replicators no longer have to be used sparingly, near limitless heals and revives, etc etc.

Limiting it to autosaves only, even with bulkhead cheese, doesn't really allow this sort of play. The most you can get away with is a small amount of abuse near the bulkheads themselves. A good example is shooting the camera in Hydro c (or is it hydro d?) immediately after the entrance, which in Alarming Cameras sets off the alarm - you can instantly cancel it with the bulkhead, and get a free save to boot.

Now I just wish there was a mod (I have been meaning to make this) that stops the endless item hoarding people do, usually in the Hydro lobby or in medsci. In my opinion that's WAY worse than save scumming as it renders the inventory largely worthless, and means players can simply horde all the resources they will ever need. If it was possible to stop item hoarding, and if it was possible to limit ammo stacks to a certain number of clips per stack (not possible), that would, in my opinion, fix the absolute overabundance of ammo the player has access to during the second half of the game, as it can no longer be easily hoarded. That said, RSD's loot hose and other changes have definitely increased the need to conserve ammo, so maybe this isn't really much of an issue anymore.


*not actually patented

[673f49c352249Join2]

'The most you can get away with is a small amount of abuse near the bulkheads themselves.'

No it's very cheesable:

-All modify attempts will be performed at a bulkhead if player is not stupid
-All weapon repair attempts (unless the player needs it done ASAP)
-Any nearby hackables or broken objects
-Any nearby high consequence threats (cameras, turrets)
-Most notably, the interconnected, slow-paced, punishing and backtracky nature of the game also further encourages bulkhead returns.

Still, like I said it's still waaay better than the lame default. Any time you're some distance from a bulkhead deep in the shit (which will still be quite a lot) suddenly every decision will be more impactful and the tension through the roof.
On a side note I was browsing trying to discover the exact functioning of the respawn system while typing this post (since it is the only consequence for returning to a bulkhead outside of added time (which can include implant battery drain etc but this is minor)), couldn't find anything but what I was met with was dozens of articles and forum posts about the enemy respawns supposedly ruining the game. I forgot about this vocal crowd. Damn casuals. Bioshock is your game...though that has respawning too if I recall yet nobody complains because vita chambers and the overall game being braindead easy.

Too bad Shock 2 is one of if not the only survival horror with completely unrestricted saving.

[673f49c35241fvoodoo47]

if you cannot make yourself not save, then you have other problems going.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-5XAmupw8jo

[673f49c3525d7Join2]

Big brain input as expected. The player should absolutely be able to save because Shock 2 is a long and punishing game, the question is where and how often. Something only a good designer can sensibly determine. Certainly not the average gamer that thinks this complex topic can be boiled down to "just don't save!" or doesn't see the fundamental design failure of player-defined saving in the first place.

[673f49c3526f2voodoo47]

if you have mid-level Shocked skills, you can pretty much shrink the enemies to three inches and make them pop like water balloons just by looking at them, or win the entire game by drinking a soda.

yet we are still capable of playing the game normally. wonder how that's possible.

[673f49c3528e3Join2]

"or win the entire game by drinking a soda."

There is no fun in that. The fun is largely in the struggle, the challenge, which player-defined saving of course runs counter to. Nobody denies that.
Yet saves in some form are desired for numerous sensible reasons, so once again the question is where and when, which is something a player cannot determine on the fly without a deep understanding of the game events and rules. There could be a really tough diff spike coming, or some harsh death trap, the player doesn't know, yet "just don't save" when it is fair the player should have one is apparently the answer...I just beat secmod 3 for the first time on impossible. I don't know what Thiefsiefool had in store for me around the corner, and yet I am expected not to save and lose much progress in a brutal and somewhat RNG-prevalent game. Wouldn't be a problem if the designer who has the knowledge instead said when I could just as he does permit health packs or ammo placements.

Please allow us to discuss the mod and future possibilities without turning the thread into another bitchfest.

[673f49c3529e5voodoo47]

fair enough.

but I think I'll go and make that shrink AIs to three inches and then pop idea into a mod, that may, unlike the soda thing, be actual fun.

[673f49c352b3eJoin2]

Turn the Stasis Field Generator into a nukem 3D shrink ray? ...to which they then pop as per your idea.

[673f49c352c21voodoo47]

pretty much.

[673f49c352dffsarge945]

I think the difference is that the feature to trivialise large parts of the game is a built-in easily accessible feature. Yes, we can type cheats into the console, or use shocked, but it's a bit different when it's BLARING IN OUR FACE, it's quite the distraction.

I don't think it's a fair comparison.

I guess if the menu option wasn't there and the quicksave binds weren't in the binds menu, it would be quite a bit easier to maintain discipline.

I don't think people who like to save freely can really understanding the feeling.

[673f49c352ee1sarge945]

REEE!! The zip expired!

[673f49c352fe8Kolya]

Sorry, I don't have it anymore. Maybe @sarge945 has a backup. Or else it should be easy enough to recreate.

[673f49c353133sarge945]

I had a backup somewhere but can't find it

[673f49c35341cPacmikey]

.