Doom & Gloom

[673f202eafc3aJoin2]

Hey old strangers. Let's start some serious talk once more. Over the years I noticed this is one of few sensible gaming forums when it comes to broader life issues.

Linked Topic: "People born before the 2000s, how do you feel about the way the world has changed?"
My response: https://www.reddit.com/r/AskReddit/comments/1b3kuuo/comment/kstle24/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=web3x&utm_name=web3xcss&utm_term=1&utm_content=share_button

Perhaps you have some bullet points to add? Perhaps you think I've lost the plot? Perhaps you think it's not all bad?

I want to see some intelligent, alternate, and potentially more correct perspectives on the matter. Or just for us all to nod in agreement. Validation can be nice.

Here's the post in case the pozzed reddit takes it down:

• Healthcare is wrecked in many countries due to reduced funding and brain drain (e.g UK, Canada). USA was always extortionate so no change there.
• The economy is wrecked, especially real estate. The rat race is not very appealing without a slice of cheese at the end.
• Journalism's credibility is in shambles.
• Wages have stagnated significantly, haven't kept up with inflation since 2000 or so, so 90% of the population is just getting shafted. Especially the younger half starting from nothing.
• The vast majority of food in North America is laden with industrial oils and such to cut costs. It's disgusting and evil, slowly poisoning you and your children.
• Sense of community is gone. Everyone is more connected...online...in echo chambers mostly, and not accomplishing anything through this connection. Real life everyone is more divided than ever.
• Video games are utterly braindead now, in addition to predatory. I would not let my children play the majority from the past 20 years or so. Exceptions of course apply, especially lower budget ones.
• Hollywood, well I used to be big into movies. I haven't watched a single one in 5 years or so. My passion was killed.
• Mainstream music went from real instruments, feel good with a meaningful message, real talent, and a vast diversity of styles to an artificially popularized (by record labels) select few, almost always with a bad message/influence on children. I can hardly stand the radio. It used to be magical feelings in abundance, a very long time ago (90s and prior).
• Corruption (institutional, systemic; large scale) was generally more subtle, but now it can't be more obvious.
• I am particularly concerned about children. Poison food, education is allegedly a complete joke in addition to 2 years at home because of COVID, and online degenerate content consumed daily without restriction. Among other things such as the aforementioned braindead video games and corrupt music.
• Unrestrained immigration in many western countries is a huge issue, e.g we don't even have the infrastructure (housing, services, healthcare) to handle a mass influx of people. I have no idea what the hell the so-called "elite" are up to, other than trying to destroy the west, but it isn't looking good.
• Mass homelessness with no solution even being planned. All the taxpayer money in the world is available for certain other concerns however.
• Relationships: family, trust, love and marriage are getting strained by numerous modern dynamics.
• Christianity is not respected anymore. I am agnostic , but nonetheless it was still a good thing to instill virtues in those not naturally virtuous or perhaps otherwise in a bad place temporarily; it was good for society as a whole. The message was largely positive.

Despite all this doom and gloom, there are a few silver linings:
-Convenience of services (food delivery etc).
-Technology has improved aspects of general living, though not nearly as much as it should (see Japan for a better standard).
-People appear to generally be less violent. It's probably just where I'm from and now no longer live though. But I still think it's generally true across the board, e.g people are subdued by cameras being everywhere and declining testosterone levels in men, in addition to other factors maybe.
-The internet, while I am confident that it is more a net negative for humanity *in its current state* (and can explain precisely why if it is desired), it does have plenty upsides too.
-Smoking is no longer glorified and heavily marketed by evil companies.
Ultimately, things aren't looking good. The governments of the western world are apparently hellbent in creating an eventual dystopia, and a lot of their decisions are aligned between nations, as if acting as a single entity (e.g UK, Canada, France and USA all have many of the same issues as a result of their decisions). Societal collapse could be near, though it is impossible to predict with absolute certainty. We're such a mess on the inside that it weakens us. Internally most of these western nations are in serious need in healing. Know that the only reason we haven't been invaded already is all your tax dollar thrown into the military, our technology, and alliances (NATO). Advanced near-future technology used against people (control, warfare etc) is also a very disturbing threat. This isn't said to scare you, it is said to educate and prepare you, mentally if nothing else.

[673f202eafe9cvoodoo47]

yeah, pretty much (living in a country that just came full circle, starting with corrupt mafia politicians stealing everything left and right as soon as the iron curtain fell, then trying to get rid of them for 30 years, and now giving the same breed of politicians power again because whatever). good thing I stopped giving half a damn circa 2011.

needs to be noted that hope is just an illusion, the world has always been a dumpster fire, maybe with some short periods where the fire burns a bit less, but that's it.

hence, "screw it, I'm-a just going to play SS2 and not care 'till kingdom come. Deus Ex too".


also I'm disappointed, was thinking the topic will discuss Doom and Gloom, as in, the games.

[673f202eb00d9icemann]

For me its lots of things in regards to the world changes. Things like "far left" and "far right" did not exist when I was growing up. People had different opinions, and if someone disagreed awesome, lets sit down and debate it. Nowadays if someone disagrees then they end up wanting to kill each other, with neither side budging an inch. I put all the blame on social media there.

Younger generations sensitivity around words and wanting them banned drives me bonkers. The left wanting some kinds of comedy banned (eg the style Dave Chappelle does) I don't like. If you find it offensive then don't watch it. Simple.

Revionist history of banning movies and media for stuff that was normal and accepted at the point in time they were released.

On the less serious side I miss the music, videogame genres and types of movies that were common when I was growing up. For example slasher horror movies (eg Friday the 13th, Nightmare on Elm Street etc), and great science fiction action films (eg Terminator, Predator, Aliens, Wrath of Khan, Back to the Future etc) were all the norm. Plus martial arts films were all the craze (due to a mixture of Bruce Lee and the Ninja craze). Nowadays I barely see a film worth watching.

[673f202eb02c0Join2]

Very true Voodoo. The world has always been total shit. Worse even. Constant warring, trampling on others for personal gain and corruption all throughout history. With the exception of post-WW2 to the 90s when things had been increasingly looking up, slowly one day at a time, generally speaking. With the exception of pre WW1/2 also with the industrialization of Britain, invention of the steam locomotive, harnessing of electricity etc. Today is a sharp decline from the standard set in the past 100 years or so, minus those german fucks going crazy for a few years (among some other wars). Yes I know we have many Germans here on this forum.
There is also the issue of the cycle of power coming to an end...e,g empires would come and go, corrupt leaders would be overthrown and so forth. That cycle ends once technology becomes too powerful. e.g Bob Page if his plans were to be carried out in full. Or Skynet. Humanity is done past a certain level of power attained by an individual, it's all over if abused...which of course, it absolutely will be. And that future (in some form or other) doesn't seem too far away.

Anyways, thanks for confirming I am not crazy. The masses so often in their utter intellectual inadequacy always have me feeling crazy when I try to interact with them. Not that I am brilliant, I'm not, but jesus fuck there is a lot of stupid people out there. Nothing we didn't all already know mind you but it never stops being frustrating and disappointing.

[673f202eb0622Join2]

On the less serious side I miss the music, videogame genres and types of movies that were common when I was growing up. For example slasher horror movies (eg Friday the 13th, Nightmare on Elm Street etc), and great science fiction action films (eg Terminator, Predator, Aliens, Wrath of Khan, Back to the Future etc) were all the norm. Plus martial arts films were all the craze (due to a mixture of Bruce Lee and the Ninja craze). Nowadays I barely see a film worth watching.

Fuck yes I do. My soul weeps for all of it. Well, not so much slasher movies, I always thought they were kinda dumb, but other horror styles + everything else you said, hell yes. Content was on average more intelligent, meaningful and substantial, and furthermore actually made for men quite frequently. Nothing is made exclusively for men anymore except OnlyFans, and well fuck that shit. Not in a million years. I am not a degenerate.
I've consumed so much good old media (games, music, movies) multiple times over that...I pretty much have run out of content lol. Though I haven't watched a movie in years as mentioned, so a mass rerun of all the classics will eventually be on the table. Classic video games never exit the rotation though. That love is unbreakable, at least until death comes for me. There's hundreds of great games + mods to keep em going, plus games are replayable by nature if good. Just wait a few years at worst.

Also, well said about some of your additional bullet points there. Things like banning words, historical revisionism, short-sighted feminism and other forms extremism I am not quite convinced is pure youthful stupidity, but rather a nefarious powerful agenda behind it all imposing it on the youth...but given it is all so widespread, I have doubts about that too. Maybe the crazies have simply taken over. Or maybe we keep giving crazy & stupid too much validation and attention, it always guarantees a reaction (which can be used to one's advantage) further encouraging it. It's probably a mix of all three. I know for sure that video game companies pull stunts of this nature for attention through controversy. It's very obvious. Then again I heard from an industry insider that the video game industry today is overwhelmingly filled with leftist extremist types. Maybe they're just being...them. Dumb, that is.

And yeah, there didn't used to be all this political extremism before indeed. Everyone was just more sensible across the board on these matters. Clown world now, as they say.
A big part of the problem is how much the youth (especially late teen & early 20s) is worshipped, pandered to, and given a microphone in the west, and has been for a long time. Kids ARE DUMB by nature due to inexperience...why would society do this. Often for profit of course. And possibly numerous other reasons.
Then, there is all the kids running amok on the internet, completely anonymous with no age displayed. That doesn't exactly cultivate intelligent discussion and societal progress, but rather the opposite. Kids are supposed to shut up and listen more often than not. That's how the old world used to be.

[673f202eb0955icemann]

Agree 100% with all of the above. Now the martial arts and action movies I grew up with, under revisionist history are now called misogynist macho films, which push a heavy heterosexual viewpoint. O....k and what's wrong with that?

Like in the case of Arnie, Stalone and Van Dam films, their generally quite buff and walk around beating up everyone. So? I absolutely loved those films. Re-watched "Cobra" (Stalone action film) just 2 nights ago. Great stuff. Average acting but still enjoyable.

As for "new" films to enjoy: I find myself on the odd occasion discovering some old 80's - 90's film I'd never heard of, let alone watched. And that's where I'm finding enjoyment, since their in that style I grew up. For example, last year discovered "Strange Days" (thanks to a Watchmojo video), which was a mixture of murder mystery and cyberpunk, with Ralph Fiennes as the lead. Has the "brain dance" tech that you see in the video game Cyberpunk 2077 long before that game came up with it.

Second was "Graveyard Shift", which is a movie adaptation of a Stephen King book. Very gory, acting is a bit mixed, but I quite like many of the movie adaptations of King's books, so quite enjoyed it. An acquired taste that one however.

Music wise I absolutely detest what is on the mainstream radio stations over here in Australia. Very R&B and pop centric. I loved grunge, alternative and progressive rock + drum and base / techno growing up. The 90s in particular was my favourite decade for music, as there was something for everyone in there. Like trance / techno? Got lots, like rock or grunge? Take your pick? Like gangsta rap, you have a sea of stuff to choose from. Plus so much more there. I find myself only liking some of the modern artists (eg Bruno Mars, The Weeknd) due to their retro sounding styles. Both have strong Michael Jackson vibes. Also for the few artists that were around when I was younger, who've changed in style but still sound quite good (eg Justin Timberlake).

And then non mainstream I find myself listening to mostly non-commercial when driving. Find it a good source for alright music + new age drum and base stuff which has remained a good music genre several decades in. Recently discovered a band called "The Cannons", who have a strong 70s - 80s style with a lot of the songs featuring synth and throw backs to Stevie Nicks (of Fleetwood Mac fame). How none of their stuff made it onto the mainstream radio stations here is beyond me.

[673f202eb0ab9Pacmikey]

Earth is Hell and God hates us.

[673f202eb0c17fox]

"You merely adopted the dark. I was born in it, molded by it. I didn't see the light until I was already a man, by then it was nothing to me but blinding!”
(Midlife Crisis Man, 2024)

[673f202eb0ebeNameless Voice]

I also feel that our planet is in the worst place it's been in my lifetime.

We've reached late-stage capitalism.  Everything is done for the benefit of an elite few trying to make profit above all else.

There's just so many awful things happening in the world recently, and we're powerless to do anything about them.
I've completely lost any faith I had in humanity, and in particular in politicians and journalists, all of whom have proven that they have no integrity or humanity.  They've dropped all pretence now.

I've never seen a time when it's more obvious that the things which are supposed to be the pillars of our society are a joke.
Democracy. Journalism. Human decency.  They've all been proven to be lies in the last few months.

All we have is people in power who trick us into electing them, and then work directly against our interests and our wishes.


Maybe I was just naive.  Maybe it was always like this.  But, before, we at least had some pretence.  I at least had the impression that our governments were trying to do things for their citizens, even if they were generally very bad at actually doing so.  But it used to feel more like incompetence rather than actual malice.

--

Others have talked about their being more division, but I think the biggest cause of that is that some aspects of society have become so extreme that any kind of reasonable debate is impossible.  If your world view is generally "try to do your best for people where possible", then what can you even debate with someone who thinks "we should murder everyone I don't like"?  Why would you even want to debate with a madman like that?  It's not like the debate will achieve anything.  Those two viewpoints are so fundamentally incompatible that no one will ever change their mind.

[673f202eb1002voodoo47]

"and then things got worse"

[673f202eb10fbNameless Voice]

I strongly suspect that they will, especially as there are disturbing parallels to the lead up to WW2.

[673f202eb1679Pacmikey]

Nameless VoiceThe standard path for life doesn't exist anymore, which is why people are depressed. Unless you're in a high demand field, working 9-5 40 hours a week won't get you anywhere.

Life has changed, income used to build wealth, but now only equity does. It's not about how much you work, but about how much you own.

Society is extremely cutthroat nowadays, the amount of value an average human being brings to the table is the lowest it's ever been. Everyone wants to be a doctor, lawyer, engineer, etc because they make lots of money, and not because they want to do that. They just get railroaded into it by their parents usually. 90% of careers people want to have simply don't make enough money anymore, so they transform themselves into good little robots to survive instead. You will never qualify for a $900,000 mortgage as a florist. Funny how just 5 years ago house prices were half.

Humanity has become a very redundant species. We have enough food, water, electricity for every person on the planet, yet we willingly decide to make things more difficult for no reason. Imagine if you saw a beehive with an infinite amount of pollen, but the bees just start stinging each other.

[673f202eb1828Nameless Voice]

Even if you're in one of those high demand fields, you're still brutally exploited.  No one is paid reasonably any more, the pay of the people doing the actual work goes down, while the pay of the parasitic executives goes up.

I saw a figure recently that a CEO used to be paid 15x the average employee's salary in the 60s (already insane), but now they are paid 351x.

I'm "well paid", but haven't had a pay rise in years, and the company has laid off hundreds of people while giving the CEO millions of dollars in bonuses.  And that's a story that seems to be getting repeated everywhere.

[673f202eb1affPacmikey]

Nameless VoiceFigures like that are why people are so bloodthirsty. If a average working class person toils daily for a pittance, then sees a landlord doing nothing and getting more money, he'll want to kill him.

[673f202eb20a5RoSoDude]

Some notes of expansion and disagreement:

• Healthcare: I don't know much about outside US. I've heard that UK's NHS is going insolvent, but I don't know the details. US healthcare is atrociously bad, of course. A few reforms in the last decade or so have helped, but only marginally (coverage for pre-existing conditions, Medicaid expansion, low-income subsidies are good, but costs keep ballooning)
• Economy/wages: I actually don't think there's too much to be pessimistic about for US/Canada, both have seen about a 25% increase in average real wages (this accounts for inflation) since 2000. We had a brief stretch in 2021 where inflation outpaced wage growth but that was a minor blip. However, real wage growth in the UK and several EU countries have stagnated due to many factors, including counterproductive austerity measures on the right and loony "degrowth" policies on the left
  https://imgur.com/a/LS4DPtL
• Housing: this is well and truly fucked in North America, though. The US and Canada have pursued an idiotic pattern of car-centric infrastructure development since the 1920s, which has created a situation where endless suburban sprawl is subsidized by the urban core. The result is incredible low density where it is literally illegal to build multifamily houses or apartments in upwards of 70% of city land (94% in some cities) due to zoning for single family houses. Besides the fact that the only way to get around such places is by driving a car on crumbling roads (due to local governments becoming insolvent by financing this development pattern), this choking grip on housing supply also artificially pushes up rents and real estate prices
• Homelessness: a straightforward problem of low housing supply caused by the above. It's not because of greedy landlords or corporate capitalism, it is the fact that wealthy homeowners have an incentive to block any and all housing development to maintain their property values. The removal of other legal barriers to housing development, as well as government investment in public housing, would massively solve this problem
• Community: social media et al surely play a major role in this, but I'd argue the surburban development pattern plays a massive role in community atomization too. People don't live and work together, public transportation is slow and unsafe so only the poor deign to use it, suburban kids are shuttled from school to soccer practice then back home to scroll TikTok rather than interacting with peers in close-knit neighborhoods, while inner city kids are exposed to homelessness, poverty, and crime.
• Journalism: The declining trust in the institutions of journalism is a multi-faceted issue. I think most alternative media is just as harmful as sensationalist corporate media, as it's polluted by crackpot idealogues weaving narratives from factoids to pander to their audience. Half of the people on the internet seem to get their information from memes and fabricated images. AI is going to make (and already has made) this so much worse. It's certainly worth examining the failures of the mainstream institutions for pushing people towards these faulty sources, but the supposed cure here is just as deadly as the disease

[673f202eb266bJoin2]

Some notes of expansion and disagreemen
t:

• Economy/wages: I actually don't think there's too much to be pessimistic about for US/Canada, both have seen about a 25% increase in average real wages (this accounts for inflation) since 2000. We had a brief stretch in 2021 where inflation outpaced wage growth but that was a minor blip. However, real wage growth in the UK and several EU countries have stagnated due to many factors, including counterproductive austerity measures on the right and loony "degrowth" policies on the left
  https://imgur.com/a/LS4DPtL

You must be living comfy. Where I am (Canada, and from the UK originally), the masses are completely shafted. As for keeping up with inflation....yeah I should have compared to the 70s. By 2000, wages were already bordering indentured slavery. Feminism being pushed to double the number of workers in the workforce (thereby increasing supply and lowering demand) is a huge reason why, alongside wages not keeping up. Anyways, an uneducated dude working a modest blue collar job in the 70s could support an entire family, vacations, house, car, if he had it good. One income. An absolute ideal standard. Now, you aint getting shit and you will NOT be happy.

[673f202eb329bNameless Voice]

I've heard that UK's NHS is going insolvent, but I don't know the details.

My understanding is that, generally, the UK's governments (especially the Conservatives) don't believe in publicly-funded social institutions like the NHS. They've intentionally been trying to privatise healthcare for years.

wealthy homeowners have an incentive to block any and all housing development to maintain their property values.

This is a huge reason for the massive housing catastrophe here in Ireland.  The government claim they want to do something about it, but in actual fact they won't do anything because their voters don't want the prices of their houses to go down.
Fairly sure the opposition also don't want the housing issue fixed because they gain votes from people who are angry at the current government for the housing problems.

It's certainly worth examining the failures of the mainstream institutions for pushing people towards these faulty sources, but the supposed cure here is just as deadly as the disease

I strongly disagree with this one, because there's an expectation that journalists have standards and are supposed to tell the truth, so when they outright lie and spread propaganda and disinformation, it's worse.
People are more wary of things they read on social media, because people there don't purport to be reliable, impartial sources.

Proper journalists with real integrity would be better, of course, but recent events have proven that those simply don't exist any more.  Media is so far gone that I don't believe it can be saved, at least not in the near term.
It's been bad for a while, but now it's got so blatant that I think a lot of people - including me - have lost any faith and will never believe anything they report ever again.

[673f202eb3640Join2]

Isn't it interesting how in the west all these countries are facing these exact same problems (mostly)? Scary conclusions can be drawn from that.

As for the healthcare talk...I have a problem of moderate severity. The system here is in such shambles that I can't even get a diagnosis, let alone treatment. I have tried approx. 15 times via clinics, and can't really afford private, unless I beg family I suppose. I am still on the waitlist to even get a family doctor. As with the UK, tax-based funding of these systems is clearly cut to be used elsewhere, in addition to mass unrestricted immigration adding further strain to the system. I also mentioned brain drain - most native-born and educated doctors here head abroad as the pay is so low. Certainly is evident. All the doctors I've met are Chinese and most commonly middle eastern, many of which I suspect have forged diplomas or whatever, because they are terrible at their job. That or they simply don't care; are heartless.

I'm "well paid", but haven't had a pay rise in years, and the company has laid off hundreds of people while giving the CEO millions of dollars in bonuses.  And that's a story that seems to be getting repeated everywhere.

The only way to reliably get pay increases is frequent job hopping and being good a selling yourself. Of course this is at the cost of comfort/job security, vacation and benefits. though if you're really valuable (I am not) those can be negotiated up front too. All in all, greed and corruption is fucking humanity big time.

[673f202eb3b23Join2]

"You merely adopted the dark. I was born in it, molded by it. I didn't see the light until I was already a man, by then it was nothing to me but blinding!”
(Midlife Crisis Man, 2024)

Hope you're not implying I am having a midlife crisis!

I have been quite clued in to a lot of this since I hit...16, 17 or so (2007). I have been extremely angry about the rat race since then, seeing that is a completely losing game and not the same fair deal people older than me got. And it's even worse now.
I noticed music was increasingly degenerate. I used to get so mad circa 2006 eating breakfast in the morning before school with my little 13 y/o sister and "GIRL LOOK AT MY BODY, I WORK OUT!" came on MTV. In the video they were literally swinging their dicks around in tight fitting underwear that leaves little to the imagination, and otherwise completely naked. How the fuck is this shit allowed on daytime TV? In the 90s, no lewd content was allowed on daytime TV. Eurotrash (TV show) and all that degenerate stuff would come on late night only. Pop music these days, many years later, still very inappropriate for the youth, and corrupting of society as a whole. In a more condensed fashion (it's worse).  In the 90s, we had Micheal Jackson singing about the corruption of the world and such, Bob Marley preaching peace love and unity, still getting blasted on the radio well after his death. In general, almost all of it was feel good and meaningful, the occasional degen song but even then it was pretty tame. It's NOTHING like that now. The radio either spits out neutral or degenerate. What was the last pop song with a meaningful message for the world, black eyed peas "where is the love?" in 2003?
Video games, again around the young age of 16-17 (2006-2007, you know what dark era that was) I noticed that games had become almost universally retarded and worthless overnight, a quality drop for all platforms and most genres. In reality it started around early 2000s in increasing intensity, but with the new gen of consoles the biggest change occurred on a very noticeable level. Just worthless retarded garbage. I still have super old forum posts of me raging shortly after. Mobile gaming also became big around this time, surpassing revenue gained from PC & console gaming through unethical business tactics (milking "whales", microtransactions etc).

I could keep listing such things, but I'll stop there.

So basically, my midlife crisis started at 16 because I was perceptive to the world around me. Because before that time, things were increasingly good the further you go back, generally speaking. After, increasingly worse. I guess my midlife crisis started very early, you could say. What's most tragic is that mostly nobody else saw these same problems.

In summary older gen x and boomer took their utter priveleged, powerful position and fucked the world over. It should have been handled by government regulation (e.g real estate investment, swift banning of gambling elements in video games and so forth), but they're too incompetent and self-serving.
No idea what to say about the scummy video game developers that collectively sold out. They were already making millions in profits, just fucking greedy human trash with no integrity. I hope they know their fortnite garbage et al is damaging to society. Bordering on child abuse on a mass scale. Created little addicted dependents consuming dumb repetitive content and purchasing the latest microtransaction by any means necessary.

[673f202eb41cbNameless Voice]

Isn't it interesting how in the west all these countries are facing these exact same problems (mostly)? Scary conclusions can be drawn from that.

Yeah, all the western countries are modelled on each other, they all have the same kind of governments and economies - ones which are specifically designed for this outcome.

As for the healthcare talk...I have a problem of moderate severity. The system here is in such shambles that I can't even get a diagnosis, let alone treatment.

I'm afraid this seems to be the story everywhere.  Ireland has (sort of) free healthcare, but it's also a shambles, huge waiting lists, queues in the emergency rooms, sick people sleeping on trolleys.  And it's not even really underfunding or privatisation here, just gross incompetence and no foresight.  And paying way too much for too many administrators and not enough for actual medical staff.
Again, no one willing to make the necessary changes because it will annoy some voters.
The skill drain is also real.  People study medicine, then immediately leave to go somewhere else because the conditions here are too bad. And why are the conditions bad?  Because there aren't enough medical staff, so everyone has to work harder to make up for it.  A deadly cycle.

---

I've had the "games were better" argument with you before, still don't agree with your conclusion.  There have been good games the whole way through, even if they tend to come from smaller or indie studios these days.  The percentage of good games has gone down, sure, but the overall number of games being made has gone up so much that it counters that.

[673f202eb456fJoin2]

I don't really want to discuss video games too much as I think it is more important to stay on the broader topic, but sorry, I know I am correct. I have played video games, on all platforms, like a crazed maniac since I achieved consciousness. Starting in the 90s, when games were in their golden era. In a very short passage of time, games were simply retarded. My beloved hobby no longer delivering like it used to. Particularly if factoring gameplay, the primary method in which video games are interacted with/consumed.

How can you possibly disagree? It's *measurable*. I was a goddamn kid at the time and noticed everything was now retarded and soulless. A kid isn't supposed to be thinking these things, just consume and enjoy, but it was unmistakable. It's measurable when a game is 100% skill-based, content-packed, and respects the player's intelligence, and now it is press x to watch animation and win. It's kind of embarrassing you don't see it too. I know you're not dumb, but it does depend on the particular games you were playing. Me I was playing mostly everything (except simulation, RTS, city builder for the most part) on all platforms (PC, all major consoles, and multiple handheld) so I got a pretty broad view of it.

Of course there has been good games. I like a LOT of modern games. Most of them indie mind you. It's just simply not the same overall. I am one of the most qualified people to determine this. I've played an unhealthy amount of games.
AAA in particular is what is dead. In the 90s, the majority of the best games were higher budget. At the forefront of technology and innovation. Now, that is the class of game producing the worst. This is tragic as higher budget is where most of the potential for greatness lies for obvious reasons. Now high budget games are absurdly high, and this causes a multitude of problems: insane manpower and focus required for graphics, huge teams causes inherent problems such as of management or lost ability to discuss and convey ideas and design vision, and then there is the matter of financial risk. At that high a budget it is only sensible that you have to play it safe and make your game accessible for everyone no matter how dumb.  I can't enjoy most AAA since 2006, they are dumb, soulless, design by committee accessible for all, and make me feel like a dancing monkey.
But if I recall, you think irredeemable, retarded, semi-automated trash like all the Tomb Raider games made after Core Design died in the early 2000s are valuable, so we are never going to agree. I KNOW you're not stupid. So this can only mean you simply don't give much a shit about gameplay, you find appreciation in art, story, characters or whatever. As someone that cares about gameplay before anything. It's bad. Really bad. So we have to agree to disagree it seems.

...nope. When braindead level of challenge, automated game mechanics, more linear level design generally, objective markers etc etc is the new industry standard, was mostly never a thing prior, there is no argument to be had, you're just wrong and polluting the thread with wrongness.lets not get sidetracked. That's a major issue today too. Diversion, distraction, division of the masses.

[673f202eb47baNameless Voice]

Probably also a disagreement of what constitutes the games industry, you're mostly talking about AAA games, but I rarely even play those games because most don't interest me at all.

What we call 'AAA' games these days didn't even exist in the '90s.  Great classics like Thief, Doom, Half-Life, etc. had budgets, sure, but they were still made by relatively small teams.

Eh, I didn't think the latest Tomb Raider games were great?  Didn't find them as bad as you seemed to, mostly that they were bogged down in icon-collection nonsense and too much combat, with enough actual tomb raiding.
I did like Anniversary, but since that's a remake of a Core game, I'm not sure it counts.


But more to your point, it's the same general trend.  Everything gets more corporate, more focused on making profit above all else, so you get games with huge budgets that try to appeal broadly to everyone and then don't actually appeal to anyone very much. They lose their focus.  Any good parts they have get watered down by too many mediocre or bad parts that detract from the overall experience.
Also, the big companies tend to buy up the smaller studios and hollow them out.

But at least in gaming, there's still some independent smaller studios who make more focused games with smaller teams.

[673f202eb4acbJoin2]

Fuck anniversary with a 100ft rusty but recently acid-anodized, serrated iron oar. That game onwards it's all shit. I'd rather play the mediocre gameboy games made in the early 2000s, or watch the shitty movies. At least that would be mildly entertaining, straight to the point, and only waste an hour and a half of my time.

You say AAA doesn't interest you, but Anniversary was a AAA equivalent of its time. Super high budget.

Yeah sure AAA didn't exist. That's just semantics. I just meant the highest budget bracket, most-produced, core industry games for the time. This means anything from lets say Deus Ex  (8 million, which was very high budget at the time) to Final Fantasy 7 (80 million, which was the single most expensive game of the 90s and an absolute outlier in that regard). Low budget indies are keeping guys like us afloat when it comes to new games, but that's not ideal is it? Back in the 90s I'd happily play indie (e.g Flash games, Net Yaroze), bargain bucket, mid-range, high budget it didn't matter all that much. If a game is good, it's good. That's all I give a shit about. They were untainted by retard politics, stupid trends, burdeneous financial risk, absurdly expensive and time-consuming graphics, all your competition selling out in unison adding further pressure and so forth. The vast majority of old games understood their nature, limitations, potential and purpose too. Gameplay was king, outside of certain PC genres (e.g adventure) which I've never been fond of. As gameplay is no longer king, but a peasant third-class citizen or otherwise super optimized...for dim people, of course I am not happy with the state of things.

I still would happily play a bunch of low budget, bargain bucket and indie late 90s games right now. I still do. All low or even non-existent budget, but simply well-put together games. I think a large part of the disconnect I have with deniers is those that did not play a wide selection of both PC games and the PS1 in particular. Classic PC games obviously you know the grandiosity of. But the PS1 is leagues above everything else too, that I value just as much. I also had the N64, SNES, NES, C64, PS2, Gameboy, SEGA consoles etc etc, still do, plenty of good games, but PC and PS1 in particular at the height of gaming brilliance (late 90s) absolutely killed it. Game design wonderland. There is no going back to those standards. If you know, you know.

Anyway, forget the AAA term, just anything with a modest or above budget. The games that drive the industry forward, others try to emulate and are produced at the core (that everything revolves around - journos, mainstream, events etc). Quake, Half-Life, Deus Ex were late 90s equivalents. System Shock 2 not so much, though it deserved to be of course. That traitorous EA!

[673f202eb4ee7Pacmikey]

Join2bro Tomb Raider Anniversary was awesome. Hell the entire Legend trilogy was awesome. I think you're way too jaded. Yes AAA games suck now, but an indie developer in 2024 has more resources than a AAA dev in 1997.