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Topic: Prey 2 - a System Shock 2 spiritual successor
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What did everyone think of Prey, by the way?

40% of the way through the game:

OK, yeah, I also recommend this game so far. It's still rather compromised and missing the true prestigious design of the classics, and there's a lot of wasted potential, yet it's a lot better than all the other neutered Immersive Sims from LG's descendants of the past decade, from Dishonored to the truly abysmal Bioshock.

70% of the way through the game where things go downhill + with better experience/play time to analyse it:

Well that went downhill fast. This game is pissing me off now.

1. All the neutering is very apparent. Fabrication license limits removed. Wep degradation removed. Suit integrity influencing oxygen levels removed. Status effects removed. Such things would have made the game generally a lot more engaging, and make all this constant loot micro-management and exploration actually worth it. Speaking of:

2. Micro-management and exploration gets tedious. 95% of the game you're looting trashcans and supply crates and reading boring emails...for nothing. I'm starting to avoid content because there's no need, and that's just not how it should be. There's operators everywhere. I have 120 food items, 30 medkits (not even upgraded med kit efficiency once), and 60 suit repair kits. The general gameplay is not working in tandem due to a lack of challenge, neutered game systems and a lack of pacing. Where's all the enemies at? No pseudo-random respawns like Shock 2? Aside from the nonthreatening mimics and the invisible phantoms this is so predicable and bland. It's the same every time: there's a Typhon or two patrolling the centre of a large room/corridor, you kill it in five seconds, then spend the remainder 95% of the time reading all the emails and looting all the garbage, rinse and repeat. The game never even surprises you with scripted enemy placement, like say a typhon locked in a cargo container that jumps out when you hack it open.

3. RPG systems and replayability: modern RPG design strikes again. With the ability to be able to get all or nearly the neuromods and all the upgrade kits in one playthrough, in addition to all this other bullshit I predict very little reason to play the game again, unless they release a fulfilling patch or someone with good design sensibilities mods this game and makes it wholesome. And of course you become an absolute god quite fast and it wrecks challenge.

4. The hacking mini-game? Surely they had the idea to include moving obstacles, target areas that shrink in size, maybe a pacman style ghost that chases you around? Do you just hate fun and derive sadistic pleasure from boring players to death, Arkane?

5. Art direction excess/excessive clutter. Ultra detail + cluttered levels + primary focus on loot whoring and micromanagement is so draining. New Vegas gets it right so it's not purely a old school vs modern thing, it's a result of art obsession and ultra detail in every damn level. Major Exception: the Arboretum. This level is not a maze of crates, trashcans, lockers and whatever else. Still a visual splendour, but it was 100% enjoyable to explore due to clear intuitive visual communication of what is worth hovering your crosshair over and what is not.
As a result of this obsessive art approach object highlights and objective markers arguably become necessary. And my god the markers are extra annoying in this game, such as disappearing when you get close, there's hundreds of them yet they're vague in the information they provide (textually) so it can be confusing which is actually relevant...there can be so many quests active at any given time that you feel like you're playing shitty borderlands or Elder Scrolls.
So, they're needed Arkane? Why not make them actually meaningful? Say a limited inventory item you can use that provides quest tracking temporarily when used? This would avoid bombarding the player with so many markers and encourage actual use of his or her own navigation skills while still offering the occassional free pass should the player feel they need it. Definitely an interesting middle ground, though also perhaps only interesting on paper.

6. Weapon variety or lack thereof. It's been said before. Another reason not to replay the game. I'm finding them boring even on my first playthrough.

7. The enemies in concept. It's been said before. Horror multiplies immersion substantially, and adds something special of its very own. You wanted to innovate/not tread old ground with the failed biological experiment route and the like, fair enough. The result is just a little underwhelming.

8. The plot. Also has been said before. This isn't like Shock 2 or Deus Ex where you're on the edge of your seat completely engrossed from start to finish. This is like in Dishonored or a Bethesda game where NPCs are so bland, boring and meaningless that you do not value them as virtual entities; they talk and you find yourself filtering them out.
Who else was thoroughly enthralled and engaged by the cutesy lesbo love story? The Cook subplot? The every day lives of half the staff in general as told by email?
Remember those people held up in the cargo bay? They were boring me, the gameplay was boring me, so I cut the leading lady off mid-sentence with a shotgun blast to the face and then murdered all the rest. I could not care less for their plight. It's mostly the gameplay's fault though. I put up with anything happily if the gameplay is rock solid.

9. Audio design and music. I went into this before. The music is at times bland, other times downright annoying. The audio cues can also be just too much, but that is also something that has seen plenty criticism already. Many sound effects in general equate to ear rape.

Second take on the recommendation: play up until you complete the Arboretum, then just quit because it goes from a 8.5 or 9/10 to 6.5/10 pretty quickly. Challenge declines, shit gets repetitious, all the wasted potential becomes apparent. It's better than most garbage these days, but honestly though? Think I'd rather replay Dead Space over this. It's all about design and execution. Complexity doesn't mean much when it's intentionally neutered with poor execution and/or pandering design, the prime example of this being Bioshock or Skyrim. Dead Space may be simpler than both, but the game design is synergistic. The king is still Shock 2 though, and Arx Fatalis still the best Arkane game.

Bear in mind this is an angry write up which I rage quit late in the game out of disappointment to post. And this is without going into all the little design intricacies that make the likes of Shock 2 plain superior. There's lots of things about PREY I'd love to praise too, but I'm not in a merciful mood. Overall it's more good than bad, and the recommendation to play probably still remains. The first 1/3 of the game in particular was great, but much doesn't hold up to scrutiny and Arkane wouldn't deny it without considering themselves disingenuous.
Yet another game not living up to the legendary classics all things considered. What's it going to take?

Many gameplay problems can and should be addressed with a patch, if they're very thorough. A lot of games have been doing that lately, patching in actual brain engagement. Better than nothing and an improvement over the last decade of utter disregard/disrespect for gameplay in general, I suppose.
Story, music, non-threatening atmosphere etc is probably unsalvageable, but the gameplay probably is salvageable and is also probably worth attempting to salvage. Do it Arkane.

The last 30% in particular was really poor. If this was released in 2007 in Bioshock's place though, I'd be a lot more content.


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When I played Prey, I did wish that Bioshock had more of Prey's gameplay, as Bioshock's amazing atmosphere really deserved more than just first person shooting gameplay, whereas Prey has little atmosphere and would, I think, have really benefited from being set in Rapture.

Prey is certainly not a classic, but it's better than many AAA titles (AAA as in high budget, high profile releases) from the past decade or so. But that says much more about the (lack of) quality of AAA titles in general than it does about Prey in particular. I'm glad Prey came out, and that I have it, but it is annoying that it fails to build on it's promises, and there's no way it should be inferior to a twenty(ish) year old game (SS2), but it is. Then again, if it did have SS2's complexity then it might well have scared away most buyers, so dumbing it down probably was good business sense. But that doesn't mean that the game's end should be so lukewarm (there isn't even any sort of boss battle, you do something and the game ends, no fanfare, no huge struggle, nothing) or that more demanding players shouldn't get more of a challenge for it.

Though I personally don't miss the lack of weapon degredation (I'm really happy it was left out, at least if it was to be as aggressive as in SS2), but the need for oxygen, the limits to how often you could create a given object, different physical and mental reactions to different hazards, etc, should have been left in, or at least been available for higher skill level settings.

I'd forgotten that object markers would often disappear for seemingly no reason. This was most annoying when you were outside the space station, heading for a distant point, which was clearly marked, then you'd maneuver around something, and when you face the right way again, the marker either has disappeared, or  the text has gone.

I completely agree about the enemies being unsatisfactory. You only encounter a few, and when you do it or they tends to be stood staring at a wall, or moving on a predefined sentry root, and easy to sneak up upon. And they don't act intelligently or even too aggressively.

The hacking game is no fun, I agree. And when you're used to it then there's no challenge, either. I never cared about any of the people, due to the bad way they were portrayed. It would have helped if you could question them, and so have deeper conversations, but no, you almost never get to hear much out of them. And that time you mention, in the cargo bay, where the survivors stood around like mannequins, not talking except to maybe say the one thing the game told them to say. I felt no concern for them at all, as they gave off no feelings or emotion, so my interest and empathy wasn't engaged.

It is a good game, but it's a good game by current standards. Not that standards were always better in the past, but I do think that the best first person shooter (and FPS/RPG) games of the past were better than the best from the last ten years or so. And I'm not sure when I'll be replaying it, which is very disappointing to me, as I'm a bug fan of replayability, and love replaying my favourite games.
Acknowledged by: callum13117
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I'd forgotten that object markers would often disappear for seemingly no reason. This was most annoying when you were outside the space station, heading for a distant point, which was clearly marked, then you'd maneuver around something, and when you face the right way again, the marker either has disappeared, or  the text has gone.

I guess it was Arkane's idea of a compromise. I don't think it worked out too well in that intention. I'd rather they try and fail though. Better than following every safe modern rule in the book to the latter.

Gone are the days of great, very reasonable game design that encouraged use of a in-game map, made good use of intuitive signposting, and made certain things exclusive to certain difficulty levels.
 
I completely agree about the enemies being unsatisfactory. You only encounter a few, and when you do it or they tends to be stood staring at a wall, or moving on a predefined sentry root, and easy to sneak up upon. And they don't act intelligently or even too aggressively.

In Deus Ex you encounter ~30 enemies on the first darn level, in addition to cameras, turrets, a swimming challenge, some grenade wall traps and so on. Shock 2 you have the constant respawns. Prey was rather devoid of challenges in general. It's a explore, loot and recycle sim, and the challenges that were present were repetitious and often not engaging (e.g hacking). Chances are it had proper respawning like Shock 2 at some point and they took it out because modern game design/pandering.

And I'm not sure when I'll be replaying it

Mods, a meaty patch restoring what have should have been in the first place, even if only exclusive to higher difficulty levels, or very, very meaty DLC. Otherwise I doubt I'd play it again at all.  Meanwhile I've got another Arx playthrough in the lineup somewhere, even after all these years.
« Last Edit: 05. July 2017, 23:54:21 by Join usss! »
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Well, I finished it last weekend and have to agree with many points made in the previous posts. For me it was a very enjoyable and good game which I never once regretted buying and would still recommend to friends. Yet it did considerably lose steam towards the end and the actual ending I got really was terribly underwhelming. A "Nah"-kind of affair but unfortunately it didn't seem intentionally so. The difficulty and ressource balancing did go downhill a bit. Also the the common complaints about the fighting never feeling quite satisfying enough, the limited weapon and enemey variety and a lack of really interesting characters are holding Prey back from being on a similar level as the classics.

Still one of the most pleasant game experiences I had in a long time and I do hope for more in the future!



Acknowledged by: Join usss!
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That could be brilliant, thanks for the link.

Will it be a commercial, standalone game, on it's own game disc, or will it be DLC? I think probably the latter, since it's not been kept so quiet until now.
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I don't know but with that group picture and all, I think it could be something bigger like "The Death of the Outsider", which was their standalone story expansion for Dishonored 2.

6745008fb2576icemann

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Hope it's better than DOTO. I found the main campaign much better. Not that the DLC didn't have a good story or anything. Nothing could top some of the levels of the main campaign that's all.

Plus the motivation for killing guards wasn't there, since they worked for the queen who you potentially played as during the main story.
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What the what?

A console gamer has infiltrated your ranks!

If a game is on console and PC, and there's not much chance of it supporting fan-made mods, then I usually buy the console version. I prefer joypad to mouse + keyboard, plus sometimes I have to work away from home, and taking a console (or two, depending on how long I'm staying), is easier than taking my desktop.
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Laptop gaming is best for portability! Lightweight an highly flexible in the games you can play on it (PC, console, handheld. Browser games. Mods, romhacks). Can even plug in controllers for emulated console games, and you don't need a television, but can still use a HDMI cable to hook it up to a TV if you want.

If I'm away from home and gaming is on the cards, I always bring my laptop.
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Hope it's better than DOTO. I found the main campaign much better. Not that the DLC didn't have a good story or anything. Nothing could top some of the levels of the main campaign that's all.

Plus the motivation for killing guards wasn't there, since they worked for the queen who you potentially played as during the main story.

I agree, it was decent though and I didn't regret getting it at a discount though.
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Oh, I always have my laptop with me (aside from anything else, I use it to type up work reports), but I don't like playing on laptop, for some reason. Even when I can plug it in to the room's TV, and use external mouse and keyboard (I always use a separate m+kb on a laptop), it doesn't 'feel' right. I'd say that's just me, but I know a few other people say the same. I probably could get used to it, but console gaming is just more convenient for me. Or was, before day one game patches, console OS updates, and other mandatory downloads were introduced to we unpaid beta-testers, sorry, we paying customers.

6745008fb37a5ThiefsieFool

Acknowledged by 2 members: fox, Join
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Sounds more like a retreat, unfortunately.

6745008fb3b01icemann

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$20 is a bit steep for DLC.
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Well, it depends on the amount and quality of content - I don't know the details here. But generally, I strongly advise anyone with an interest in the future of Prey (and to an extent the genre), to throw money at them instead of being a scrooge.
Acknowledged by: RoSoDude
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