System Shock VS System Shock 2 VS Bioshock

[673446b432066Kyur]

Well, here it is: the final scores by the fans. Bioshock is released for quite some time now and most of you sure have completed it at least once. Time to rank all three games in your personal opinion. Which one is on first place and your winner, which ones are on second and third - and why ?

Maybe some might say that they can't be compared because there's so much time between each title. Well, look at it this way: which title gave you most fun at it's time ?

I must admit that right now, I stayed away from Bioshock until I get a computer which can handle the high requirements of the game to get the best out of it and not to distort my first impressions...

[673446b432230Guilty Spark]

I think Bioshock is the god of games period(Except for the Halo franchise which i'm still the most loyal to) But Other than Halo 1, 2 , and 3 Bioshock is THE best game of this day in age. But at the time of shock 1 and shock 2 i think i like Shock 2 the best because it was the game that got me into gaming, and the way it got you so involved, it wasn't one of those "Shoot him, shoot her and after everybody is dead you see a crappy cutscene and the scrolling credits" NO! It was as if you were actually there, and every decision meant the sacrifice of one thing and the gain of something else. It also required MATURE decisions you couldn't just run & gun you had to keep an eye on your inventory and your ammo and your money, nanites and cyber modules, you had to think about whick gun to use for every situation...and... well word just can't describe the sheer brilliance of Ken Levine and the rest of what i still call Irrational Games.

[673446b43248cKonstantin]

I am a more of a SciFi person and for me SS2 is hands down the best.
I played BS and I was not impressed. SS2 set the standards very high in terms of gameplay, immersion, spookiness, atmosphere, voice and sound. I really tried to like BS but I couldn't. There were some scary moments in BS, I got scared and I guess since I am more of a futuristic minded person, going back to 40s and 50s isn't for me. I am not into nostalgia. The inventory in BS gave no sensation of control over my items. I got used to SS2 after a while and fell in love with it, you just cant beat the power of managing your items by yourself, eat when you want to eat and toss what you have to free up room for another item. I understand that  for console (360) you must do it as seamless as possible  but PCs are other breed.
The story line is another point of pivot for me, while it has enough depth I found it hard to follow, the Atlas/Fountaine twist was alright though. I finished it once and felt no motivation for a second run though I harvested all Little Sisters. 

I guess I was expecting some sort of SS3 instead of BS: futuristic, horror, loneliness, in SS2 I always felt like being alone, strange to the rest of the ambient and in Bioshock although they try to make you feel alone I could not feel enough difference between the character and the rest of the splicers/people.

The graphics in BS are outstanding, in terms of technical point of view the game is well polished, its just that it had no appeal for me.

Well thanks for reading.
Konstantin. 

[673446b4325b1sinick]

system-shock-2 = #1.

system-shock-1 = #2.
this is just from playing 1/2 hour of this game. this is a gem. I coulnd't play more because of the difficult controls.

bioshock = #999
was very fun 1st time but just has no replay value. I tried 2nd time even with better computer but just not fun to play again.

[673446b432a67Join ussss!]

Have not completed SS1 so its hard to say, I would rate bioshock above it but I think if i had played SS1 around release date I would have enjoyed it much more than BS & SS1 was ahead of its time compared to doom, whilst bioshock is a rediculous step back compared to everything LGS. (well i have not played championship golf or flight simulator... but they dont count, different genres)
Bioshock IS a good game it just doesn't deserve to stand next to its older brothers, since it sold out its family for riches.... That is understandable in a way, but it should have had optional gameplay settings at least (like 1999 mode) that gave it more depth in many areas, and also in my opinion it needed a change of pace in terms of levels- in SS2 you start to get a little sick of the same setting(von braun & rickenbacker quite similar), then the many biomass & "where am I?" really slaps you in the face. bioshock its just the same old rapture with a little sister escort section right before the final boss, still arcadia(hydroponics on steroids) and the level afterwards with the crazy art dude were memorable, its such a shame gameplay was simple, immersion design was reduced and the game overall just had some bad gameplay decisions, especially unlimited inventory & vita-chambers which on Xbox you could not at least turn off, no patch.

But I predict even BS:infinite will not beat SS2, but i hope to be surprised.

Scores
SS1- no real verdict until I complete
SS2- 10 out of fucking 10!!!!
BS- 8.5/10

system-shock-1 = #2.
this is just from playing 1/2 hour of this game. this is a gem. I coulnd't play more because of the difficult controls.

If the game beat you into submission with its old school controls that means you cant rate it above bioshock since you probably completed bioshock yet gave up on ss1. But I suppose like me you can easily see right from the start it was a great innovator in its days unlike bioshock, and im probably being a little hypocritical because the controls are the main reason I have not got into it all too well, but im not gonna give up! EDIT: wait what? you pulled up a 5 year thread? oh well to late now. not like it matters anyway forum not overly active.

[673446b432e91Join ussss!]

understand that  for console (360) you must do it as seamless as possible  but PCs are other breed.

Nope not true I have just set up SS2 with Xpadder on a xbox360 pad and it is near perfect with the correct setup. only problem is to change Psi power you have to do it from your PDA, but if there was a quick select option like skyrim or a radial menu like deus ex HR console then all neccessary keys would be on the pad.

here is my set up

RT=shoot
RB=use
LT=jump
LB=inventory/use mode
Left stick=movement
left stick click=crouch
right stick=look
right stick click= drop navigation marker(ran out of important options)
A= quick rad hypo
B= quick med hypo
X= reload
Y= quick wrench (ran out of important options)
d-pad up= change ammo type
d-pad down= change fire mode
d-pad left= previous weapon
d-pad right= next weapon
start= pause menu
select/back= play last audio log

I never use quick save/load when i play PC games, find it cheap, so am glad they are not assigned.
would assign creep mode but it has the same effect as crouch? not sure never used it.
shame there is nothing i can do for psi powers quick select, need five free buttons to scroll through each tier of psi powers.

[673446b433062icemann]

My order:

SS2
SS1
Bioshock

[673446b4331c1Kolya]

My order:

Coffee
Work
Beer
Sleep

[673446b43335eBadKarMa]

I really wanted to like BioShock, but I couldn't connect to it. I've aborted the game quite quickly. The setting is nice, the visuals stunning and the audio great. However the mad people you meet somehow give you the feel of videogame NPCs/monsters and break the atmosphere. That was different in both System Shocks. The mutants had a dull AI, but that didn't distract. All those audiologs sometimes even created a connection to a certain mutant. Additionally BS felt more like a solid horror-shooter with puzzles. SS felt like something different. More like an RPG-Shooter. And it felt more non-linear. Then again I didn't play BS long enough to make up my mind.

For the both System Shocks I can't decide, which one to rank higher. SS2 has a superior playability and a slightly better leveldesign without that annoying cyberspace. The horror is great and overall everything feels enhanced to its predecessor. Yet that is the reason, why I can't decide: SS1 has a much better concept. It's sort of an isolated 1on1 man vs AI from the beginning to the end. It affects you more. SS2 strives away of that by introducing the many and Xerxes and SHODAN doesn't feel that powerful.

[673446b433644Join ussss!]

. However the mad people you meet somehow give you the feel of videogame NPCs/monsters and break the atmosphere.

I have heard many people say they found Bioshock scary! I just dont see it, The game has atmosphere but it is in no way scary. 

[673446b43375aicemann]

The only scares I had in Bioshock were quite similar to that of the kind I had in SS2, which was the instances where I was busy doing something (ie listening to a audio log) and a enemy snuck up on me.

[673446b433af1RocketMan]

SS2 has a superior playability and a slightly better leveldesign without that annoying cyberspace.

I don't understand this...  Ken Levine and the rest of the team apparently picked up on it which is why he explicitly stated that cyberspace was to be a lesser component of ss2 than it was in 1 but wtf?!  Cyberspace was awesome.  Why do so many people dislike it?  I've heard some say it makes them dizzy... I get that.  It was a bit simplistic too.  I get that.  But I mean the computers at the time would have chugged if it had been as elaborate as originally planned.  For what they could get away with, cyberspace was awesome and I really missed it in ss2.  If not for ss2's prowess in other areas I would have been stewing on the fact that there was no cyberspace while playing through the game.

SS1 FTW by far.

[673446b433c34Kolya]

Completely agree about cyberspace. It added twinworld gameplay ( Twinworld (1989), Soul Reaver (1999)) to System Shock that made it a lot more interesting. 

[673446b433ec8BadKarMa]

Why do so many people dislike it?

The general idea is okay - but with the different controls, visuals and sound it felt like a bonusgame. Only that this bonusgame was necessary. The way it was was just annoying.

[673446b433fc4icemann]

I absolutely loved Cyberspace in SS1. The fact that the controls and gameplay was completely different to the main game made perfect sense.

[673446b43412eBriareos H]

Same here. In my book, SS1 is better than SS2 by a small but distinct margin. Both are miles ahead of Bioshock 2, which I find slightly better than Bioshock 1.

[673446b4344fcProblems]

Nope not true I have just set up SS2 with Xpadder on a xbox360 pad and it is near perfect with the correct setup. only problem is to change Psi power you have to do it from your PDA, but if there was a quick select option like skyrim or a radial menu like deus ex HR console then all neccessary keys would be on the pad.

here is my set up

RT=shoot
RB=use
LT=jump
LB=inventory/use mode
Left stick=movement
left stick click=crouch
right stick=look
right stick click= drop navigation marker(ran out of important options)
A= quick rad hypo
B= quick med hypo
X= reload
Y= quick wrench (ran out of important options)
d-pad up= change ammo type
d-pad down= change fire mode
d-pad left= previous weapon
d-pad right= next weapon
start= pause menu
select/back= play last audio log

I never use quick save/load when i play PC games, find it cheap, so am glad they are not assigned.
would assign creep mode but it has the same effect as crouch? not sure never used it.
shame there is nothing i can do for psi powers quick select, need five free buttons to scroll through each tier of psi powers.

So I guess you don't lean 

[673446b434899unn_atropos]

#1 System Shock and System Shock 2
System Shock
Didn't dare to start playing System Shock for years. Couldn't get used to the controls and had overall troubles in getting it to work. So I often started but gave up right on the medical deck.
Recently, while working on the log page, I made the decision to finally play it. The old problems are gone now; there are mouselook and a stable working game.
I played it and wanted to kick my ass for not doing so earlier because this game is amazing! There are so many ideas, so many cool features, Shodan is great as always. This game is so much packed with cool stuff, that System Shock almost feels a little empty.
Everyone is complaining abpout the ending of System Shock 2, but I consider the ending of System Shock to be equally lame . Though it made me kind of euphoric with the great music and the glowing title that says:"We are not finished! More is yet to come!!"

#2 Bioshock
For this game I'm more fan of the small details. I like how the splicers are running at you while scratching the walls with their hooks (wish the enemies in Sys 2 could do this). I like the bunny masks; hidding the destroyed, spliced up faces.
But what I like most is the rotting art-deco architecture along with the adds and the matching music. I like how the water is slowly gaining access to the city. Everything looks so beautiful and deadly at the same time.
The downside is, that there are to much enemies. I wouldn't if I could walk trough Rapture on my own without beeing bothered. More in the urban exploring way, you know^^

[673446b434c06Join ussss!]

Snip

Completely Disagree, SS2 is way better. SS1 is awesome 10/10 amazing for its time, and is the reason SS2 and DX etc exists, but SS2 is much better.
SS2 has way more gameplay elements, smoother controls, newer engine (which provides increased immersion and much better level design) and a more in-depth story.
The only things SS1 has over SS2 imo is:
-The dark areas that you need to light up either by head lamp, sight drug or a light switch.
-Cyberspace!!!
-Changing the difficulty for different aspects of the game.
Everything else SS2 improved upon.

[673446b434d3aKolya]

One thing SS2 really did improve was the sound. This makes up a large part of SS2's atmosphere.
What fell short in SS2 were the tons of controls you had and increasingly gained throughout SS1, that really made you feel like an omnipotent superhacker.
The line between game options and in-game options was blurred and they used that to great effect. This is a chance that SS2 really missed.

[673446b434e1fFironkkuify]

One thing we can all agree on is that SS2's control scheme, even the pre-set ones, was much easier to use.

[673446b435032RocketMan]

I wonder to what effect people's admiration of ss2 over ss1 had to do with the order in which they played the games and/or their age?  I'm ashamed to admit that although I am old enough to have played the first one first, I didn't because I didn't know it existed until I'd played ss2 several times.  All the same, my core beliefs about what makes a game good are still intact and I had to give the win to ss1 because to me, any game can entertain well if crafted with care.  Even a text based adventure can do this.  To this day many people hold the opinion that books are a better way to explore a simulated reality than movies can provide.  I don't know if I fully accept this but I uderstand why people say it.  SS1 was extremely "dense".  The immersion was not effectively conveyed through atmospheric devices like sound or lighting but it did so just as well via secondary characters and their development, through realistic gameplay mechanics, through interaction and widgets, through a great interplay between claustrophobia and feeling exposed.  The world was there to be felt, you just had to succumb to it and not expect to be slapped in the face with it.  SS2 felt far easier to accept as an immersive experience because the technology was there to deliver a more accurate simulation but by the same token, those benefits meant the player ultimately demanded less of the game in terms of rich detail since he/she was already being adequately stimulated by audio/visual cues, which ss2 did so well. 

I love both games but I'll never feel quite the same about ss2 as I did about ss1.

As for Bioshock, I have to group it with all other games in order to judge it fairly and then I would say it's an excellent game overall.... job well done.  If I were to consider it with only ss1 and ss2 however, I'd say it fell short in too many areas to be on the same playing field.

[673446b435703Join ussss!]

So I guess you don't lean 

Nope, strafing has the same effect in SS2, only faster, ok it allows you a preview around a corner but I just bust in there and tear em a new one, however with a few adjustments I could swap quick rad hypo & quick med hypo for lean L + R, then change the layout slightly. Only time lean is needed is in stealth games like thief, and the older LGS games like SS1, but its nice to have the option in SS2 for those who want to use it, the more options the better.

What fell short in SS2 were the tons of controls you had and increasingly gained throughout SS1, that really made you feel like an omnipotent superhacker.
The line between game options and in-game options was blurred and they used that to great effect. This is a chance that SS2 really missed.

Huh, What controls? Did I miss something, or do you mean hardware & software upgrades you get? Also remember in SS2 you are not a hacker, well it depends on what employment role you choose at the beginning I suppose.

I think Bioshock is the god of games period(Except for the Halo franchise which i'm still the most loyal to) But Other than Halo 1, 2 , and 3 Bioshock is THE best game of this day in age.

Would you mind if I PM'd you death threats every now and then, you know you deserve it. Nah im just kidding, or am I? 

[673446b43586eSteve]

1.SS2

 2. Bioshock
 3. SS1