SSR: System Shock Kickstarter

[67447d79d6d33Myagi]

NDS: Look we made a demo!
Fans: Cool!  Maybe a little close to the original, but hits nostalgic sweet spots!
NDS: Nah, we don't like Unity.  We're changing engines.

What personally really rubs me the wrong way during these events, is the bait-and-switch that went down. It doesn't even matter if I like the new look or not.

There was a playable prototype that defined the basic aesthetics of what was being "sold"*. The KS text literally says

This demo represents the look and feel that we want to achieve with the final version we'll deliver to you, our backers.

(* pedants that want nitpick that the KS project isn't selling a product can put a sock in it )


Sure the following line is a disclaimer that

Please be aware, this is a proof of concept; the PERFORMANCE, FEATURES, and VISUALS are subject to change

but you have to be able to take a KS in good faith, not treat it as a legal document where some lawyer is trying to weasel in loopholes. So if the demo is "the look and feel that we want to achieve with the final version we'll deliver to you", what is reasonable for the disclaimer to mean is that some tweaks an adjustments may happen, but not that it will turn into something that has 0 semblance of what they, by their own words, wanted to achieve.

[67447d79d6f38lgs]

I have an impression i'm the only person in this universe who likes the new art direction and where everything is going.

[67447d79d7076Section]

Nah, I'm totally fine with all the new art style and the direction the reboot is going. I'm eager to see what Night Dive have in store.

[67447d79d71e7icemann]

I didn't mind the new art style either. Just bring on more video updates done in the style of this one please.

We'll get a far better view of exactly what's going on if they do.

[67447d79d7328la0s]

The art style is maybe okay. It just seems like they are too ambitious. Iit is daunting enough to remake a game, and I am a bit sceptical about them rebooting the game.

[67447d79d7582Join2]

Don't like:

-KS bait and switch. Presenting ultra purism and then when they got their money, did something else only partially related with it. Good thing I'm not one of those suckers who throws my money at people based on promises alone.
-Doing the typical reboot shit and replacing the original in title: calling it "SYSTEM SHOCK".
-What they were honest about. Their shit boring approach to music.
-I am not convinced their design talent have what it takes to deliver true LGS-style greatness, though am open to being wrong. People probably didn't expect high quality and something worthy of a classic from me either.
-Possibly too realism-centric level design, but this is a minor concern as the original was somewhat realism-focused too. I just hope they don't cross a line.
-Added stealth playstyle. Shock was a combat game at its core, period, and introducing stealth as an always available option conflicts with this and also changes up the design considerably. After five years modding Deus Ex I say pick stealth or combat and focus on one. If you want optimal stealth or combat anyways, rather than the two treading on each others toes.
-Confident fear it will be just like every other modern game of this type. That being, generally weak...and being too similar to them. Somewhat overly commercialised, similar gameplay, and generally not representative of Shock/classic LGS ingenuity. 

I won't really be following this one, though I will most likely get it after it releases, depending on what the old guard say. As always expect the worst, hope for the best.

[67447d79d78b5Zanderat]

I have an impression i'm the only person in this universe who likes the new art direction and where everything is going.

No, I  like it.  Some changes were necessary.  Let's hope that it is still recognizable as SS when released.

[67447d79d7ba9Olfred]

I think it's not that most of the people dislike the new style. They are just upset that a remake was promised and now a reboot is happening. And many pledged on Kickstarter just to be let down afterwards.

Personally I wouldn't see it looks bad. I would say that what's currently shown is something between decent and good. They managed to capture the 80s style sci-fi and the overall tone. But the looks don't have anything in common with the original anymore.

[67447d79d7d93fox]

Well, watching it a second time, it looks a bit better then what my first impression was but to me it still seems uninspired, generic and not on par with the the first demo at all. But most of all uninspired. Like that blood splattered children's play corner (or any of these blood splatters). All that did was to make me think "Right, Dead Space 2 had it, Bioshock had it...". It's supposed to look edgy and "hint" at horrific events but really just comes across like a bit of a cheap shot nowadays. Also, what the hell does a children's corner do on Citadel Station?

I don't know, maybe I'm being too harsh and unfair but the video just didn't do much for me.

[67447d79d7e99icemann]

That's a fair comment, since Bioshock 2 and Bioshock had them.

My first thought was Bioshock 2 when I watched the video.

[67447d79d7f8clgs]

SS2 had plenty of blood splatters all over levels as well, it's a part of environmental storytelling and i don't see how it's a bad thing.

[67447d79d8091fox]

Yes, but it depends on the way it's done. Simply plastering the map with one of a handful of generic decals every couple of meters isn't inspired environmental storytelling, especially not with the level of visual detail that is possible nowadays. If anything that calls for subtler design, imo.

[67447d79d81d2Olfred]

Well, there are two ways of putting blood splatters into a scenery. Either you just plaster them all over and it looks like you send someone with parkinson and two buckets of red colour through the room. Or you put a little more effort into it and actually tell a little story with them, so people basically could detective the shit out of it, if they want to.
It really depends on the tone you want to set, which one is the prefered method.
From the video you can't really tell what they did. And as mentioned all they have right now is some kind of "quick mockup" to test playability and stuff. So I wouldn't judge about that right now.

[67447d79d830efox]

I really hope that they'll put great effort and passion into stuff like that. They have to, if they want to have any chance at recreating the magic of the LG-games.

[67447d79d83f3icemann]

I think this will be something all to itself. Recapturing that lightning in a bottle is next to impossible.

[67447d79d857avoodoo47]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-fSqFWcb4rE

I'm actually pretty ok with a full reboot, but I can imagine the purist/semi purist group not being too happy about the switch.

[67447d79d869dicemann]

This featured in an update about Underworld Ascendent but it was System Shock related so mentioning it here:

Apparently the original System Shock and Ultima Underworld got a few awards back in their day. I was unaware.

[67447d79d87c0fox]

RPS: "When is it OK to remake a classic game?"
https://www.rockpapershotgun.com/2017/11/22/when-is-it-ok-to-remake-a-classic-game/#more-492061

[67447d79d893eKolya]

That's a good article, although not applicable to System Shock since we still have the original running. Any  remake will just add to that, like a good remake of an old movie might get people to re-watch the original. And a bad remake might do the same.

[67447d79d8a48fox]

I think parts of the article are applicable to SSR too and the old Lucas Arts adventures were just as playable and available as SS1 still is, before they received their remakes (maybe with the exception of Grim Fandango).

[67447d79d8b9cJosiahJack]

Is it bad that I'm encouraged by all this?

I mean don't get me wrong, I'm still hoping Night Dive can make it awesome.

[67447d79d8d38icemann]

I love the idea of remaking games in general. Shame the indie remaking scene has all but died. Was quite popular from 2000 - about 2013. Used to be championship contests (over on retroremakes.org) with money prizes.

Now companies crack down on it more (eg like with AM2R and Pokemon Uranium last year). You can still get away with it as long as you go with something from a company that doesn't exist anymore + the game rights never went anywhere + name your game something different.

They present a good challenge if your into games development, to attempt to try and recreate them programming wise, without any source code to go from, and to only have what you've seen and played yourself to understand from a gameplay perspective how everything works (much like how porting of games to other systems used to be done back in the 80s and 90s by smaller companies). As you get each gameplay element right it all slowly falls into place bit by bit. Really fascinating stuff.

I love it.

[67447d79d8e54JosiahJack]

Agreed, it's a ton of fun.  Takes a while, but that just means the fun lasts a long time.

I'm finding it interesting the sharp contrast between NDS's interpretation and my own.  I especially like all the machinery bits in their version.  I hope it turns out.

[67447d79d9020edx]

Something that was mentioned about the SS1 source code in the Reboot discord channel, and that I think I didn't see mentioned here:

Stephen (CEO) - Tuesday 13th at 2:53 AM
@Gumbemanden Source code is getting close, we're going to release two versions, one unmodified and one we've spent the last few months cleaning up

An upcoming source port will most likely replace the Enhanced Edition on Steam