SCP Beta 4 Issue Reporting

[6743bc4fdee8eThiefsieFool]

The keypad UI is handled by the engine. A "broken" keypad image doesn't even exist in the game resources. So fixing this would require creating such a graphic, then reimplementing the entire interface in Squirrel.

Why reimplement absolutely everything? The feature description makes it sound like you can just show a sprite over the original keypad interface if it's broken, and hide it if it's not broken or becomes repaired. I dunno if the broken keypad warrants that much work, but just theorizing.

[6743bc4fdf028voodoo47]

would have to be implemented for all keypads, as some/all of them are breakable/can crit fail hack.

fun fact - in cd vanilla, you actually can crit fail a keypad repair, making it just disappear, as they never created any kind of real setup that would be handling such a scenario. poof, it's gone.

[6743bc4fdf404ZylonBane]

Why reimplement absolutely everything? The feature description makes it sound like you can just show a sprite over the original keypad interface if it's broken, and hide it if it's not broken or becomes repaired.

Hmm, that does sound more practical. The overlay would have to exactly match the positioning behavior of the engine's overlay code (the keypad can end up at either the top or bottom of the screen depending on the resolution), and I don't know if it's possible for Squirrel overlays to render on top of engine overlays.

RSD knows more about all this stuff than I do. I've only used the overlay API at the most rudimentary level.

By the way, the room that this keypad leads to is my least-favorite room in the entire game. It looks like some unfinished space that they just threw a bunch of random crap into without caring whether any of it made any sense. A desk with no chair? A computer you can't stand in front of? A giant pit in the middle of the room with four-foot-high walls that you have to climb over to get into it? Two different kinds of light fixtures? A computer console niche with nothing in it? The ugliest wall texture? Sure, all of the above!

[6743bc4fdf57aJosiahJack]

Either I've never been there, or I've sufficiently forgotten the game enough where it's time for another playthrough.

I can't help but feel like the pit is supposed to be sunk down.  Wonder if that would be too much of a departure.  Does SCP adjust level geo or just contents?

[6743bc4fdfab8RoSoDude]

Hmm, that does sound more practical. The overlay would have to exactly match the positioning behavior of the engine's overlay code (the keypad can end up at either the top or bottom of the screen depending on the resolution), and I don't know if it's possible for Squirrel overlays to render on top of engine overlays.

RSD knows more about all this stuff than I do. I've only used the overlay API at the most rudimentary level.

It's trivial to query the native overlay's window coordinates using one of the overlay script services, but your fear about the display is well-founded: custom overlay elements always display behind native overlay elements, and also intercept all mouse input. So the only way to change the behavior or an on-screen native overlay element is indeed to disable it and reimplement it from scratch using a custom overlay handlers.

And please don't bother with any of that because RSD will no longer be compatible (only one custom overlay handler allowed per mission) 

[6743bc4fdffa0ZylonBane]

Wonder if that would be too much of a departure.  Does SCP adjust level geo or just contents?

We have gone mad with power in adjusting level geometry. But yeah, I just know that if we got rid of that giant thing sticking up into the room, somebody would complain about it being iconic or whatever.

And please don't bother with any of that because RSD will no longer be compatible (only one custom overlay handler allowed per mission

Ahem...

There is one big difference however, and that is that script code can register multiple overlay handlers. The overlay service has AddHandler/RemoveHandler functions, instead of SetHandler as the C counterpart. The reason is to avoid conflicts if there are multiple mods active that contain Squirrel scripts. It's possible that two different mods might want to add overlay elements. Accidentally calling Add/RemoveHandler multiple times won't cause any problems, the only thing to note is that the last added handler is always moved up to highest priority.

[6743bc4fe0208sarge945]

Would it require reimplementing the entire interface from scratch?

What if the broken keypad was actually a separate object, which when repaired, became a regular keypad?

Wouldn't you then just have to make a "broken" overlay that displays when frobbing the broken one, just a messed up screen and a repair button? No trying to guess coordinates or trying to draw over everything else?

Or am I completely confused like usual?

[6743bc4fe03d9ZylonBane]

SHODAN fight testing update.
- Big giant head now doesn't start firing until 1.5 seconds after you arrive, giving players a chance to orient themselves.
- Avatars now don't start spawning until you arrive, so they can't be for example already standing right next to where you spawn in.
- Killing an avatar now guarantees that it will be gone for the full respawn period (about 15 seconds), instead of respawning anywhere from 1 to 15 seconds after being killed. But...
- Avatars now guaranteed to respawn at every respawn opportunity, whereas before a respawn attempt could fail if the player had line of sight to all spawners. So with the above change the minimum time you can be rid of avatars has increased, but the maximum time you can be rid them has potentially greatly decreased. So the respawn interval might need to be bumped up to keeps things roughly at parity with vanilla.
- The more shield segments you destroy, the more pissed off SHODAN gets. Maximum pissed-off-ness dependent on difficulty. The video below demonstrates the behavior for Impossible difficulty. On Easy there is no increase at all.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pDyGDEGb_Lg

[6743bc4fe0734Nameless Voice]

The broken keypad on Recreation, when frobbed, still shows buttons etc, but they can't be interacted with.

I have seen this trip-up a few people in the past, myself included, thinking the keypad was bugged when it really just needed to be repaired.

This is exacerbated by the fact that every other repairable device has a scrambled/broken interface when the device needs repair, but not the keypad.

Would it be possible to fix this in SCP by giving it a scrambled/broken interface?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0rWO05wmkyY

[6743bc4fe0821ZylonBane]

Where did that broken "Repair" UI graphic come from?

[6743bc4fe0909Nameless Voice]

It's the UI for a broken security crate.  Don't think that's used anywhere in the game normally.

[6743bc4fe09f9ZylonBane]

But that says "CONTAINER" on the side. Did you modify it?

[6743bc4fe0afcNameless Voice]

Oh.  Looks like I accidentally had a leftover modified version from SecMod somewhere in my game files.

Still, since it's not used anyway, could include that in SCP too.

[6743bc4fe0d82sarge945]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0rWO05wmkyY

Oh my god, that's amazing.

Thanks!!

[6743bc4fe0ed7ZylonBane]

Been playing around with the engine cores trying to make them look more detailed than just five-sided huts shoved through a couple of walls. Not sure if I've gone too far, or too not far enough.

[6743bc4fe0fcdvoodoo47]

I think I'd be ok with this.

[6743bc4fe10efsarge945]

It actually looks nice enough to be the major area that it is, while still not being overly detailed and out-of-place.

It gets my tick of approval.

Also, is it possible to make the pipes go into a conduit or something? They look odd just going straight into the wall.

[6743bc4fe126cChandlermaki]

That looks fantastic. I'd keep it.

[6743bc4fe1520ZylonBane]

Also, is it possible to make the pipes go into a conduit or something? They look odd just going straight into the wall.

The problem is that they don't come out the other side.

Fortunately the walls are just thick enough to pretend there's some internal piping in there.

[6743bc4fe18faRocketMan]

So from now on, SCP is going to be this running architectural reno project?  I'm seriously considering just sticking with old revs from now on because I can't make myself not notice this stuff.  It sucks because I won't be benefiting from any serious bug fixes from now on.

[6743bc4fe1a3bvoodoo47]

tweaks to the architecture have been a thing for a very long time.

[6743bc4fe1cc6ZylonBane]

I can't make myself not notice this stuff.

I'm not following your thought process at all here. Why would you want to not notice it? It's basically the exact same engine core as in vanilla, but higher-poly. We're not turning it into the Enterprise warp core here.

[6743bc4fe20b4tiphares4]

Been playing around with the engine cores trying to make them look more detailed than just five-sided huts shoved through a couple of walls. Not sure if I've gone too far, or too not far enough.

If i may throw my 2 cents in as a mere & mortal end consumer (player of system shock 2) i would say its fantastic, awesome, perfect.

The engine-core rooms were always kind of much underwhelming to me, they always seemed unfinished. Just maybe align it with the floor grates textures, so it would blend in more nicely:


[g38hse34yx7612.jpg expired]

[6743bc4fe21e0voodoo47]

I'm more annoyed by the nacelles (the insides) looking exactly the same (lit up) before and after activation.

was tinkering with the light setup there, trying to have it disabled until the nacelle is activated, but it's a bit too intricate to allow that.